asked the Taoiseach if he will inaugurate some means of assessing the numbers of emigrants leaving this country annually and for the first time so that there would be available at all times current precise statistics, which would obviate the controversy persistently obtaining in regard to emigration figures.

Accurate statistics of net emigration are available for intercensal periods. It has already been announced that a Census of Population will be taken in 1961. The information collected at this Census will enable accurate figures of net emigration to be compiled for the period 1956-61.

As has been indicated in replies to other questions on emigration, it has not been found possible to devise means other than the imposition of rigid frontier controls or the taking of an annual census of population to obtain reliable estimates of annual emigration. On the grounds both of expense and of the inconvenience which would be caused to the general public it is not proposed to adopt either expedient.

Does the Taoiseach not consider that it would be in the best national interests to have information of this kind available at any time to us? The intercensal periods are long. Does the Taoiseach not agree that with the co-operation of the shipping companies and the air lines a simple means could be devised of having records kept?

The Deputy is making an argument.

In reply to the Deputy, I do not think so.

Would the Taoiseach not think that it is desirable to devise such a system of determining the number of emigrants leaving this country annually in view of the fact that, while we do not know the number of people who are leaving the country annually, we do know the number of cattle that leave annually?

No system would give reliable information which did not involve a very rigid check upon everybody entering or leaving the country and that would involve, clearly, such inconvenience to the public that it would be unwise to undertake it.

Surely there could be some method by which anybody who intends to leave the country to take up employment in Britain could notify that fact on a card either through the shipping service or the air service?

That would depend on the willingness of the individual to do it. He could not be made to do it.

Surely he could be compelled to do it?

Where does the Taoiseach get the emigration statistics which he uses when in Opposition?

I should like to inquire, is not the Taoiseach aware that the Minister for Finance gave us what we understood him to mean to be reasonably accurate estimates of emigration which showed that approximately 100,000 had emigrated since 1957?

There are some figures which show what the trend of emigration is. They are not reliable figures. They may enable comparison to be made with one period and another and, in so far as there are such figures, they show that though the volume of emigration is still very considerable it is decidedly less than it was in 1956-57.

Would it be true that the Taoiseach is now gambling on that computation?

He is a good gambler.

He says so himself. He invites all of us to gamble with him.