andMr. McQuillan asked the Minister for Defence whether members of the Army Jumping Team are permitted to take part with civilian teams representing Ireland in international competitions.

Applications from members of Na Buan Óglaigh for permission to take part with civilian teams in international competitions are dealt with on their merits. The normal practice is to grant such applications where no objection to such granting appears.

Would the Minister consider favourably the granting of the usual facilities, such as leave with pay?

That has been done in respect of other sports.

Is the Minister aware there is a public desire to combine our best horsemen and horsewomen in one team? The present arrangement is not bringing results.

I do not quite understand what the Deputy is saying.

I think we should not confine our national jumping teams to Army riders.

There are practical difficulties in having a hybrid team.

Such as?

One very important one is the honouring of the National Anthem and the National Flag.

I am sure Tommy Wade would honour both the Anthem and the Flag.

One of the authorities that choose the civilian teams has objected to the use of the National Flag and we cannot have officers on a team that does not honour the Flag and the Anthem.

Apart from that very serious difficulty, is the Minister aware of the damage done to the prestige of Irish bloodstock when jumping teams are sent out in our name which, through no fault of their own but solely because of lack of resources in horses and so on, are not able to give as good a display as it would be possible to achieve with a properly representative team?

If that material is available in the country why does it not produce results on its own?

The civilians would be strengthened by the Army jumpers.

I do not see the advantage of the Deputy's argument. If there is excellence of civilian horsemanship in the country surely that could display itself at these international shows?

It has.

Well then, why not be satisfied with this?

I am talking about the Army team.

I am talking about representing the country and not just individuals.

Could I ask the Minister to clarify the statement that the civilian authorities organising teams object to the Flag and the Anthem? My information is that they have not so objected but that the matter has been raised and that they have insisted on the Anthem and the Flag.

Is the Deputy referring to the Irish Olympic Horse Society?

Yes.

They have duly honoured the National Flag on all occasions but they are not representative of the show jumping authorities. It is those who have objected to the use of the National Flag and Anthem, and who have some sort of non-committal flag that I have in mind.