asked the Minister for Justice the number of men in the Garda Band; and if he will state in respect of the twenty-four members of the Band who were formerly members of Army bands the dates upon which they joined the Garda Síochána Band.

The reply to the first part of the question is 38. The reply to the second part is in the form of a tabular statement, which, with your permission, a Cheann Comhairle, I will have circulated with the Official Report.

Following is the statement:

Would the Minister say how many of the 38 in question were musicians before they joined? Would he also state whether it is necessary to be a qualified musician before joining or whether the Garda give training to men as musicians?

That would appear to be a separate question.

Of the 24 members who are now in the Garda band, and who were formerly members of some Army band, how many had to pay this £200 apiece in order to get the privilege of joining the Garda band?

We are delighted to get them.

I am sure the Minister is when they have to pay £200 out of their own pockets to the Minister for Defence.

They do not pay £200 to join the Garda band.

They pay £200 to get out of the Army Band.

We recruit them to the Garda Síochána in the same way as we recruit any other citizen.

I take it the Minister would not take a serving soldier and the Minister must be aware that, before these men join the Garda Band, they have to part with £200 of their own money. Surely it would be timely for the Minister for Justice and the Minister for Defence to consult together and do away with this anachronism, which is grossly unfair to the individuals involved.

I have no interest whatever in where they came from. The only thing that interests me is that they apply to become members of the Garda Síochána and, having been members of the Army band, they are good musicians and we are delighted to get them.

Would the two Ministers concerned put their heads together? Would the Minister for Justice consider making arrangements with the Minister for Defence, or vice versa, in order to allow people to move from one band to the other at no personal cost to themselves, or have all trained by the Army School of Music with no compulsion on them to pay £200 apiece to transfer to the Garda?

That seems to be a separate question.

A contract is a contract.

I am much obliged to the Minister for Agriculture for his dissertation on law.

I understand what a contract is but some of our lawyers do not appear to know what it is.

That is the kind of thing to which objection is taken. It is good enough for the workers.

In reply to the last supplementary, it seems to me it is a matter for the individual concerned whether he wishes to leave the Army or not. If he wishes to leave the Army, he naturally must abide by the prevailing Army rules and regulations in regard to his leaving. Once he has left the Army, he is free to apply for membership of the Garda Síochána Band. In that capacity we are delighted to get him.

There must be something very wrong with the Army if he pays £200 to get out.

On the contrary, the fact that we are so happy to get these men would seem to indicate that the Army imparts particularly valuable training to them.