The Minister reserves the right to dispose of the shares. Does this mean that the Minister, without reference to the House, can dispose of the shares? Is this not a new procedure? Is it the thin end of the wedge where, if a State company is a paying proposition, it can be handed over to outsiders?

I made a further investigation, following the observations made by Deputy Corish. The Minister for Finance claims he must have the right to dispose of these shares. The provision is common to the other State concerns registered under the Companies Act, but, in actual fact, sections 8, 9 and 10 provide for the appointment by me of the directors, the chairman and the managing director of the B. & I., with the consent of the Minister for Finance. Section 14 provides that the articles of association of the British & Irish Steam Packet Company must be consistent with the terms of this Bill. The Minister for Finance could not dispose of the shares to a private outside company because the Act determines that the directors of the board must be appointed by the Minister for Transport and Power, with the consent of the Minister for Finance, and it is inconceivable that the Minister for Finance would sell the shares to another company whose board was appointed by me with his consent. Therefore, we cannot sell to a private company without having an amendment to this Act.

Would the Minister say, now that he has told us he has authority to appoint the directors and management, that it will be possible for us to come into this House and ask questions in regard to the B. & I. or will the Minister tell us this is not his function?

Does the Deputy want to start a wordy argument on that?

I want to know if we, as the representatives of the ordinary people of Ireland, have the right to come in and ask questions of the Minister, who admits he has the power to appoint this board?

I have already explained that in detail to Deputy Cosgrave.

This does not seem to arise on section 4 of the Bill.

I have been asking questions like this for a long time but they never seem to arise on anything; it is an unsatisfactory situation.

I have made three lengthy statements to the House.

That meant nothing at all.

They meant a great deal and the Deputy never referred to them. He has not taken my speech paragraph by paragraph and questioned me on their import. He has never even had the politeness to deal with my three lengthy statements paragraph by paragraph, even to indicate that they are inadequate. He merely gets up and makes complaints. On the occasion of my next Estimate, might I ask the Deputy to go back and read the speeches and I shall be delighted to make comments on each paragraph in relation to my powers as Minister in charge of a number of State companies? I shall be delighted to argue with the Deputy on the basis of these statements——

The Chair has pointed out that the matter is irrelevant on this section.

The Minister has pointed out to me that I should have read his explanation paragraph by paragraph. His explanation appeared to be all right but it was not an answer to the questions I had put down regarding State companies. I still consider we are entitled, and we will be entitled in the future, as representatives of the people, to ask questions about this new State company. If, for argument's sake, this State company started to advertise in the manner in which they have been advertising up to now, would we have any right to come in here and ask questions, and would the Minister co-operate and say: "I shall have inquiries made as to how and why this is done"? These are things that should be answered now.

The Chair is concerned only with relevance and the matter raised by the Deputy does not arise on this section.

The Minister has just mentioned that he appoints the top management and the board of directors. These are the people who will run the B. & I. in future. If something of moment occurs, say, the building of a new ship, can we come in and ask the Minister how much will the ship cost, or any such question? The Minister will say it is not his function. That is scandalous. He says that is day to day administration—the purchase of a ship that cost £2 million——

The Deputy has ventilated his objections and I cannot allow this discussion to proceed. It does not arise on the section.

I shall keep today's Dáil Debate because I shall use it again when the Minister's Estimate comes before the House.

Is it intended to issue shares?

It is not intended to issue any further shares now. In fact, further shares will not be issued without the consent of the Minister for Finance.

I know that. I take it it is not intended to offer them to the public?

It is not.

Fourth Stage?

I should be glad if we could take the remaining Stages now as we are most anxious to pass the Bill.

Agreed to take remaining Stages today.

Bill received for final consideration and passed.