asked the Minister for Defence how many applications were received for military service medals from old IRA members in the year up to 30th November, 1968; the number granted for the year; and the number refused.

1,086 applications for the Service (1917-1921) Medal were received during the year which ended on 30th November, 1968.

357 medals were awarded and 206 applications were refused during the year.

It will be appreciated that some of the applications disposed of during the year had been received before 1st December, 1967, and that many of the applications made since that date are still being investigated.

Who are the people, what association, would be involved in certifying for a medal?

The people who certify for applicants for medals—who certify their membership—are the certifying officers of the company in which the man served, if they are alive and available and the certifying officers of the battalion if they are alive and available. In addition, the records that were supplied under the 1934 Act are consulted. If the applicant's name is on the list it is an indication that the applicant was a member. However, if his name is not recorded on the company list then there is an immediate doubt.

The Minister must have some records in his Department for a long time.

Yes, that is correct.

If certain people can certify wholetime, are the records in the Minister's Department still there? I should like to know if certain people can still apply, people whose names have been with his Department over the past 20 or 30 years?

I do not follow the Deputy.

Are there people who have been certified by verifying officers but whose names are not on the records of his Department for 1924 and 1934? It has been proved that the names of these persons have not been recorded in his Department. They are certified as being entitled to medals by virtue of having taken part in the fight for this country between April, 1922, and June, 1922. They are still certified by certain people but, because they are not suitable to the Minister's Party——

We cannot have a debate on the matter now.

To qualify for a service medal, the applicant must be certified to have been a member on 11th July, 1921—not 1922——

Yes, 1921.

——and for three months prior to that date. I have explained to the House the manner in which these cases have been investigated since 1957.

What has happened? There have been developments.

With particular reference to the certification the Minister mentioned, would it be a fact that some of the 206 that had been refused were certified by a commanding officer of those times?

With regard to the 206, I do not consider that there was any fraud in those cases.

I am not suggesting that.

I know the Deputy is not suggesting it. There are people who think that by virtue of certain services they rendered at the time, they might be entitled to a medal and they apply. We have, however, to insist on membership. The Deputy can rest assured that membership is essential and it must be certified that the man was a member. If his name is on the list supplied in 1934——

From 1924 to 1934 is a long time.

Some certified people might get a medal and some people certified might not?

It could happen.

I am calling the next Question.

However, it would not happen unless there was a conflict of evidence on the file.

I understand.