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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Social Welfare Benefits.

Means test for unmarried mothers allowance

Summary

The Minister explained that court-ordered payments specifically allocated to a child were disregarded, while some voluntary payments counted as the mother’s means. He was reviewing the practice with a view to disregarding the full contribution; he gave no firm commitment or timeline. Members also disputed the Chair’s handling of supplementary questions.

asked the Minister for Social Welfare the reason for the disparity in the treatment of unmarried mothers, in so far as their allowance is subject to means testing, if the child's father voluntarily gives financial support but is not means tested if such support is as a result of a court order.

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Any payments made to an unmarried mother by the child's father as a result of a court order——

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Some Deputies sought to ask supplementary questions in relation to the last question.

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John F. O'Connell An Ceann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

I am sorry, I have called the next question. I would like to allow 20 supplementary questions but I cannot do that, unfortunately.

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There were two questions that the Minister sought to deal with together. There were only two supplementary questions taken. There were several Deputies on this side of the House——

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John F. O'Connell An Ceann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

Everyone wants to participate. I have gone on to Question No. 10.

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John F. O'Connell An Ceann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

I have allowed the Deputy's point of order.

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I would ask the Chair if he would look to this side of the House to see if there are people seeking to ask supplementaries before he asks the Minister to proceed to the next question.

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John F. O'Connell An Ceann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

I will run the business here. I have looked over to that side and have allowed numerous supplementaries.

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Myra Barry Miss M. Barry Fine Gael

On a point of order, did you not see my hand up?

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John F. O'Connell An Ceann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

No. I am sorry, Deputy. I have gone on to Question No. 10.

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Any payment made to an unmarried mother by the child's father as a result of a court order, which specifically allocates the money to the child, is disregarded in the assessment of means for the purpose of entitlement to unmarried mother's allowance.

Where a payment made by the father, otherwise than as a result of court proceedings, does not specifically allocate the money to the child, it has been the practice to assess portion of the payment as means of the mother. Following representations from groups representing unmarried mothers I am having this practice reconsidered by my Department with a view to having the entire contribution in such cases disregarded as means for the purpose of unmarried mother's allowances.

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(Limerick East): Is the Minister aware that, even when there is agreement that the father should contribute to the child, unmarried mothers are actually availing of free legal aid and going to court to get court orders to maintain the children so that the Minister's Department will disregard this payment in the means tests? Is the Minister aware of the full implications of the anomaly in this scheme whereby the Department takes account of payments made voluntarily by agreement by the father but do not take into account payments made on foot of a court order?

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I recognise that in virtually all cases the courts allocate maintenance solely to the child and consequently it is as the Deputy suggests. It is because of this situation that it is proposed to amend the prevailing practice in relation to the assessment of means.

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(Limerick-East): What is the exact nature of the commitment that the Minister is giving now? Is he going to have a look at it or is he saying he is going to change the practice?

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I am saying that I am having it reconsidered within the Department with a view to having the entire contribution in such cases disregarded for means purposes.

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(Limerick East): Has the Minister issued a specific instruction to his Department to disallow payments such as this in means testing for the unmarried mothers' allowance?

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Currently I am having the practice reviewed in conjuction with the appeals officers with a view to making that arrangement.

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(Limerick East): It is still a bit vague. Has the Minister actually taken the decision to disregard such payments in the future or is he thinking about it? Has the Minister issued an instruction? Where do we stand on it?

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It is fairly clear from what I have said that I am having the practice reconsidered in conjunction with the appeals officer with a view to having the entire contribution in such cases disregarded. That makes the position clear enough.

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(Limerick-East): Has the Minister any information from the free legal aid centres as to the extent of the problem I am raising where there is agreement and mothers are still processing claims through the courts?

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I recognise that in all cases the courts award the payment solely to the children. I am not aware of the actual statistics in relation to the putting of appeals through courts for that reason. But I accept what the Deputy says.

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John F. O'Connell An Ceann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

I have allowed five supplementaries. We have arrived at a stage where I will gladly continue if the House agrees to give longer time for Questions. We cannot continue as we are. I would suggest that Deputies bring this to the Committee on Procedure and Privileges because a lot more time should be given to the answering of questions.

11.

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