asked the Minister for Communications if he will clarify the position regarding the issue of licences to companies engaged in the supply, installation and maintenance of telecommunications equipment for use by the public.

Section 87 of the Postal and Telecommunications Services Act, 1983, transferred to Bord Telecom Éireann the exclusive privilege of the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs for the operation of the national telecommunications network only up to, and including, the connection point in subscribers' premises.

With effect from 1 January 1984, the Minister for Communications has power to license persons under section 111 (2) of the Postal and Telecommunications Services Act, 1983, to provide services beyond that connection point, subject to prior consultation with Bord Telecom Éireann which has statutory responsibility for the proper functioning of the national telecommunications network.

Firms which wished to be licensed were asked to apply to my Department for licences. Applications received are being processed. Licences have not yet been issued, however, pending reconsideration of the licence fees to be charged about which proposals are to be made by an association representing some of those involved.

The Minister is aware that firms presently engaged in this type of work are operating without a licence. Will the Minister give an assurance that no prosecutions will take place until such time as a reasonable licence fee is agreed with the association?

I assure the Deputy that until we make decisions on the applications there will be no action taken against anyone.

I do not believe it is reasonable to charge a licence fee of £24,000 to firms engaged in the provision of PABX systems and other internal telephone systems, warning systems, burglar alarm systems and so on. These firms operated without any licence in the past and were not subjected to any charge. As a result of the imposition of this penal charge the Minister will create many job losses.

A question, Deputy, please.

I am asking if it is reasonable to charge £24,000 for a licence where none existed before.

The point has been made that in certain circumstances the fee may be unfair. I have met representatives of the companies concerned. They put a case to me and they are to come back with proposals from their association. As regards the point made by Deputy Leyden that a fee was not charged in the past, it was the Government of which he was a member which introduced the Bill making this provision.

We cannot have argument.

This is a very important matter. There are 3,000 people depending on the answer to this question. If the Minister prosecutes all the operatives there will be massive job losses this Friday night.

I cannot allow a speech.

We take great responsibility and pride for bringing forward Bord Telecom and Bord Post but we did not bring forward a licence fee of £24,000. Does the Minister think it was jumping the gun to put in advertisements on 22 December 1983——

The Deputy should comply with the requests of the Chair. We cannot have speeches. That is what Question Time is developing into. Furthermore quotations at Question Time are not permitted.

Is the Minister aware that an advertisement was placed in the Irish Independent of 22 December 1983 which made it mandatory on all the people involved to apply for licences and obtain them before 1 January 1984?

What the Deputy says is correct. As he will know the transition of the biggest Department, in fact half of the Civil Service, to two semi-State bodies was a massive operation. There were hundreds of problems to be solved. Great credit reflects on the staff of the Department and of the two boards that everything was sorted out with great ease. There will be no prosecutions until the problem has been resolved.

May I ask a final supplementary?

Will the Minister please answer Question No. 2?

2.

asked the Minister for Communications the number of firms engaged in the supply and installation of PABX systems; and the number of employees engaged in this work.

I do not know the number of firms at present engaged in the supply and installation of PABX systems or the number of employees engaged in that work. However, 18 such firms have already applied to me for licences under section 111 (2) of the Postal and Telecommunications Services Act, 1983.

Eighteen firms have applied. I reckon they employ 3,000 people. Will the Minister consider postponing the imposition of this licence until 1 June 1984 pending full negotiation and discussion with the organisation involved? It makes a laugh and an ass of the law if we bring forward a law on 1 January saying it is illegal to have——

The Deputy may ask a question but not make a speech.

Does the Minister consider——

The Deputy has already asked that but he has not let the Minister reply.

Does the Minister consider that it makes a laugh of the law to bring in legislation and then say you will not prosecute?

That is argument.

Although this major operation went off very smoothly we anticipated there would be some teething problems. However, there is no problem in relation to this. We are having discussions with the association concerned and I have no doubt that a very amicable arrangement will be forthcoming in due course.

Will the Minister postpone it until 1 June 1984?

I am in consultation with the association and companies concerned. We will come up with some arrangement which will be satisfactory.

The Minister will not prosecute?

I have already said I will not.