asked the Minister for Energy when the study of the potential of wind power as a source of energy will be available.

The purpose of this study is to appraise the wind power potential of Ireland. It involves the collection of wind data and carrying out an in-depth analysis of the information obtained.

As planned, the data for this study is being provided by both the Meterological Service and from my Department's wind demonstration programme. While considerable work has been done in having the study carried out, progress was delayed due to teething problems experienced in monitoring the wind demonstration projects.

It is considered that two further years' data is required in order to have sufficiently comprehensive results. Therefore, the wind evaluation study will not be available until shortly after that time.

Does work on the study in question involve the collection of information from some continental countries where work on development of wind-based energy is more advanced than it is here? Has any information been sought or made available from those areas?

The Deputy did not ask that in the question. We are in contact with other European countries and are aware of their experiences. The Deputy will be interested to know that in the early eighties the EC started collecting data for a Wind Energy Act for Europe but, because of financial cutbacks, they had to bring the project to a halt before it was completed. We would hope that the project would be recommenced. Indeed, it may even be completed by the end of next year.

Apart from this study, would the Minister of State indicate whether it is still the position that the ESB are the body or the institution primarily charged with the investigation of the whole area of alternative energy?

We have the co-operation not alone of the ESB but also of other State bodies, such as the NBST and the IIRS, as and when necessary. As the Deputy is probably aware, we have agreed with the EC a wind energy demonstration project under which we have established five wind turbines in Inisheeer, Sligo, Ballyferriter, Fermoy and Ballinamore. It is these five windmills that will form the basis of the study referred to by Deputy Kirk. Yes, we do have considerable contact with the ESB.

The Minister of State is aware that, at one time, the basic research and the implementation of our research programme in this area was the responsibility of the ESB on behalf of the Minister's Department or that of the Government. Is that still the position?

In some cases they had two wind turbines in operation and they are directly monitoring them. But my Department's wind demonstration programme forms the centre core of our examination of wind potential. I should stress that we should not expect too much at this point from wind as a source of power, that we are still in the experimental stage only——

Who is the Minister telling?

Indeed, Deputy Haughey's own experience in this field should bear that out.

I am sorry to persist with this but at one time the ESB were designated by the Government to be the primary agency of research and development in this area. I accept that the Minister's Department have overall responsibility for surveys, the collection of information, even deciding policy. In an area of this type, of alternative energy generally as well as wind power, there is a need to have some one agency or institution physically responsible for research and development. Is the ESB still that organisation or not?

No, my Department is the Department charged with overall responsibility for the wind power programme. We have installed five wind turbines in co-operation with other bodies. They help us when we need some technical assistance. The Meteorological Service, under contract to my Department, are carrying out this report with assistance of EC funds. They are also being assisted by my Department's wind demonstration programme. Therefore, it is centred in my Department.

I am glad to have that information. To be absolutely clear on it, the entire alternative energy programme, including research and development, is now centred in the Minister's Department — of course, necessarily involving and deploying other agencies and instruments from time to time. But the responsibility for research and development for alternative energy is now in the Minister's Department?

It has always been centred in my Department. Where necessary, we use State agencies or outside bodies for advice. Indeed, the ESB did manage some of the windmills earlier on. They still have two wind turbines under their direct aegis. But the report to which Deputy Kirk refers will be centred around the five wind turbines which are being grant-assisted by the EC and which will form the core of this report.

And the ESB are responsible for two of these only?

They have two wind turbines, one of which is not working very well.

I keep adverting to "alternative energy" whereas the Minister keeps talking about "wind power".

The question is about wind power.

Yes, but when the Minister says that his Department are now responsible in this area does he include all alternative energy?

That is certainly a separate question.

I am having an intelligent discussion with the Minister.

The Deputy could have an intelligent discussion about anything but it might not be in order and this is not in order.

I am asking the Minister if, when he talks about wind power and the responsibility of his Department, does that responsibility extend to all forms of alternative energy such as wave power etc?

The Deputy is correct — in relation to all other alternative sources of energy, such as solar energy, wave power, duo-thermal, we are the Department responsible but we cannot afford great resources and we are happy to buy international knowledge——

The Minister has answered my question and no irreparable parliamentary damage has been done.

None that time will not cure.

Many people are very interested in this area and it is important that I should be able to find out the answers to these questions. This has been a very constructive exchange of views interrupted only by your good self.

If one Deputy, whether the most junior or the most senior, takes over Question Time, it is not fair to the other Deputies, it is the business of the Chair to see that every Deputy gets a fair run. Perhaps Deputy Haughey would like to take over the Chair.

I can suggest an alternative.

The Minister said that his Department are responsible for alternative energy. Have the Department had discussions with the Department of Agriculture concerning the potential in relation to horticulture of alternative energy?

I am aware of an interest in this area and, indeed, two projects are in existence. However, it is a separate question——

It is only about the potential in relation to horticulture.

I would be happy to answer it but we were talking about wind power. In relation to Deputy Haughey's query, I do not think we should expect a lot from alternative sources of energy which are being examined at present. My own feeling is that the best potential lies in wind power. Solar energy may be feasible but I do not think there will be considerable substitution of the existing sources of energy for some time.