asked the Minister for Finance if he is satisfied with the level of access for the public to Kilmainham Jail; if he intends to put any proposals to the trustees to encourage greater access to the jail; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

Kilmainham Jail is vested in the Commissioners of Public Works who have leased the premises, subject to certain conditions, to the Trustees of Kilmainham Jail Restoration Committee. The management of the jail is a matter for the trustees. The jail is at present open to the public on Sundays from 2.30 p.m. to 5 p.m. The trustees are considering how best to ensure that the jail can be made more accessible to the public in the future.

Most uninformative.

Is the Minister satisfied with the position? After all, it is the property of the Commissioners of Public Works and is she satisfied with access during two hours a week to Kilmainham Jail, particularly in view of the closeness of the jail to the Royal Hospital, which is a major feature for tours and visits? Does she not consider that Kilmainham Jail should be open on a wider basis during the week to be included in such tours?

The day to day running of the jail, including the fixing of the opening hours, is a matter for the trustees and their committee, subject to the proviso in the lease that the jail shall be open to the public at all reasonable times. The conditions of the lease specified "that the historical museum be open at all reasonable times". My personal opinion is that two hours a week would not seem to be very reasonable.

Am I to understand from that since the lease says that the jail should be open at all reasonable times and since nobody could consider two hours a week on a Sunday afternoon being all reasonable times, that the trustees are in breach of the lease and in that regard ——

This seems to be developing into an argument.

It is very sensible.

I am simply asking if on that basis the management are not in breach of the lease, as the day to day management is not simply a matter for the trustees but is a matter which is laid down in the lease. Could that not therefore be dealt with by the Minister?

I accept that as a reasonable point. I shall go as far as to say only that the terms of the lease are at best ambiguous and open to interpretation. Personally, I would not be satisfied with two hours access a week, but the Department of Finance have recently appointed a trustee and I understand that the matter is receiving considerable attention at the moment. It is hoped that in the future the matter will be resolved satisfactorily from the point of view of the public.

A brief question.

A final question.

Could the Minister say if she would regard access for groups or organisations who are holding commemorations to be reasonable requests, particularly regarding Members of this House? Would the Minister consider that a reasonable request for the trustees to grant?

I would only venture an opinion as to the hours of availability to the public for access and two or two and a half hours does not seem to me sufficient, as a personal opinion. The trustees are the people to whom to put that last question concerning who has access, rather than when access is available.