asked the Minister for the Marine the plans, if any, he has to meet the former employees of Irish Shipping Ltd. to discuss their case for compensation; the total cost to the State of the liquidation of Irish Shipping; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

11.

asked the Minister for the Marine when he last met representatives of the former employees of Irish Shipping to discuss their case for compensation; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

I propose to take Questions Nos. 5 and 11 together.

As I explained in reply to previous questions on this matter on 24 November last, the question of compensation for the former employees raises complex and sensitive legal issues which require the most careful consideration. I expect to have examination of the issues completed and conclusions brought to the Government for consideration shortly. The Minister met representatives of the former employees on a number of occasions, the most recent being on 25 September last when he met them together with the Minister for Labour, Deputy Ahern.

The estimated total cost to the State of the liquidation of Irish Shipping is £51 million.

I regret that the Minister, Deputy Wilson, left the House just as this question was being taken. Does the Minister of State recall that a similar answer was given this time 12 months ago, that this would be resolved in a reasonable time? In November of 1987 we were told it would be resolved in due course and now the Minister says it will be resolved shortly. This has been going on since 1985. Employees are still without compensation and many are still without their wages and living in poverty. Could the Minister tell us precisely what is the reason for the delay? When will they get their due moneys paid to them?

It is a complex and sensitive issue. If the Deputy wants a definitive answer, it is easy to say that it cannot be done. We are doing something which is a lot more difficult. We fully appreciate the dilemma in which the Irish Shipping workers find themselves and we are trying to establish if there is any possible solution to this problem which does not expose the State to the level of liability which I referred to in answering questions in the past. At that time we referred to something like £200 million if we deviate from the statutory regulations which are there.

To date we have been unsuccessful in finding a mechanism to achieve this objective but I am certainly not reluctant to keep on trying. I can assure Deputies that every effort is being made to bring this matter to a conclusion. I expect to have this examination of the issues completed and the conclusion brought to the Government within a short period.

The latter part of the Minister's reply really worries me. The Minister now indicates that he has got no further along the road to solving these very complex problems than he had three years ago. Yet the Minister is able to say that he hopes to have it resolved shortly. Can the Minister explain that? If the matter is so complex that they cannot find a solution and he is working on it and trying to do that, how can he expect to resolve the matter shortly? I cannot follow that line of reasoning. Surely if there are complex legal problems the Minister should either be thinking of legislation to overcome those problems or some system such as an ex gratia payment which would not be covered in the legislation that he was talking about.

The questions are becoming rather long.

Has the Minister considered this type of measure to compensate these people?

When I say resolve, it could be resolved one way or the other. It would be very easy to resolve it one way and the Deputy is aware of what I mean there. I am anxious to try to find a way to assist these people.

I said the conclusions of the examination will be brought before the Government shortly. The cost already to the Exchequer has been about £50 million. If we deviate from the statutory redundancy payments——

It would cost £200 million.

The Deputy has answered the question for me which in fact was the answer he gave when he was on this side of the House.

It is an answer the Minister did not accept.

I understand very well the complexities of the situation and the fact that aspects of international law are involved here. Would the Minister not agree that the easiest way to remedy any injustice that has been done to the Irish Shipping workers would be to create another Irish Shipping as his party promised in Opposition?

That is a separate question. This question deals with the employees.

I wanted to ask the Minister if, as part of the compensation to employees, the Government are considering re-employing them in the shipping sector.

We certainly have done something along the way; perhaps not as much as we would like. Last year we brought in the Shipping Investment Grants Bill with the support of the Opposition.

We published it.

We took action. Last year it cost about £.515 million. We provided £1.3 million this year under the Shipping Investment Grants Bill. We will look at any case which comes before us and of course we will introduce the business expansion scheme to cover this and the question of corporation tax. We are doing our utmost to try to resolve the difficulties of these people which were created with the collapse of Irish Shipping in 1984.

I want to ask one further supplementary.

I will allow a brief supplementary from Deputy Mitchell and a brief supplementary from Deputy Mac Giolla and then I shall pass on to another question.

Does the Minister rule out the possibility of creating Irish Shipping Mark II as promised by Deputy Wilson when he was the shadow Minister?

I ruled that out as being a separate question.

Will the Minister answer yes or no?

I will answer it if it is ruled in order.

I merely want to assist the Minister in coming to a decision as to what he means by shortly. Can the Minister say that in six months time he will have a definite answer?

We are getting into repetition at this stage.

I would expect that within that period there should be a definite answer.