asked the Minister for Justice if his attention has been drawn to a survey (details supplied) of Dublin city centre business in which one third of firms indicated that they had to spend in excess of £20,000 annually on security; his views on whether this type of expenditure is on the increase; and if he has any plans which will help reduce this cost for business.

I am aware of the survey in question. Unfortunately, it has come to be generally accepted, and not alone in this country, of course, that expenditure on security is one of the inescapable costs of operating a business. While the Garda play a vital role in the prevention and detection of crime, it is simply unrealistic to expect that they can provide adequate protection for every target which business activity presents to the resourceful criminal. The business community have to accept a special responsibility for the security of their own businesses and the Garda actively help in this regard by providing expert surveys and advice to business people aimed at enhancing the security of their business and premises.

It is a truism to say that expenditure on business security will be reduced when the incidence of crime in our society is reduced. The reduction of crime is, of course, one of the primary aims of the Garda and the evidence is that they are achieving a measure of success in that area. The recorded level of indictable crime has fallen by over 17 per cent in the period 1983 to 1987. This is not to deny that crime rates still remain a cause for great concern.

The Garda authorities inform me that Garda members liaise closely with business interests, offering crime prevention advice and other appropriate assistance. I understand from the Garda authorities, too, that in 1987 a very high percentage of all recorded crimes of larcenies from shops in Dublin city centre were detected by the Garda and that very substantial quantities of stolen property were recovered. I also understand that preliminary indications are that the incidence of larcenies from shops in the city centre has decreased by almost a third in the first five months of this year in comparison with the corresponding period in 1987. The Garda attribute this success to the very high level of co-operation and liaison which exists between them and the business community.

The Garda authorities assure me that this co-operation will be maintained and indeed enhanced where possible and that all that can appropriately be done to assist the business community will be done.

Is it not the case that has risen in the period mentioned by the Minister? If that is so, is it not the case, Minister? If that is so, is it not the case, that the criminals are transferring their activities to the suburbs?

The number of larcenies has decreased.

That is in the city centre.

The Garda give the following statistics for larceny from shops in the city centre.

I know.

It is good news and it is nice to hear a little good news in this area. It is something we all welcome.

I have heard that. The point is that larcenies generally have gone up in the same period.

If the Deputy wants to ask a separate question on that I will deal with it when I have the full and detailed information available to me.

That is a publicly known fact.

I have figures for indictable crimes for the country as a whole and for the DMA which are as follows. In 1985 in the country as a whole there was an increase of 8.5 per cent; in 1986, a decrease of 5.2 per cent; and in 1987, a decrease of 1.47 per cent. For the first five months of 1988, as compared with the first five months of 1987, there was a 1 per cent increase in the country as a whole. The answer to the Deputy's question is yes, there has been an increase.