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Dáil
‹ Leaders' Questions.

Government decision on metro project

Summary

Sargent pressed the Taoiseach for a decision on the metro, citing conflicting views within Government and a waiting consortium. The Taoiseach said the Government was seeking a cost-effective proposal and would consider the matter in the coming weeks.

I will leave aside the allegations of corruption for a moment to deal with the equally serious charges against the Government of a lack of competence and cohesion and, in the case of the Taoiseach, a certain lack of leadership. This is being increasingly revealed in the disagreements between high level members of Fianna Fáil, the most recent example being the Leader of the Seanad disagreeing with the Minister for Transport. The Minister informed us of the length of time it takes to bring a public transport project to fruition while the Leader of the Seanad informed us that it is the Minister's fault that we do not have a resolution to the problem.

Will the Taoiseach inform us when the Government will decide on these matters, especially the metro? He will be aware that the Government decided to proceed with a metro system for Dublin 20 months ago. He will also be aware that, a year ago, the Rail Procurement Agency presented a business case proposal for the metro to the Minister for Transport for a final Government decision.

We have seen repeated changes to the story in the newspapers. The Sunday Tribune of 5 January last stated that the Minister was planning to present to Cabinet within weeks a proposal for a €2 billion metro line which would be in place before he left office. The Irish Independent of 13 February last informed us that the price had increased to €3 billion but that the proposal would still come before the Cabinet before the end of the month. By the end of the month, The Sunday Business Post stated it had been reliably informed that the Minister now had a price tag of €4 billion and that the proposal would come before the Cabinet within five weeks with construction to commence in late 2004. In March, the price had increased to €4.8 billion, at which point the Minister for Finance said the proposal was unrealistic.

Will the Taoiseach inform the House whether, following the Minister's escapade in Madrid and a revision of the price to €3.4 billion, this issue will finally be decided on by the Government at tomorrow's Cabinet meeting or whether we must wait another ten months and endure more dithering?

Comment on this

The RPA has advised that construction of the Luas system, while encountering difficulties over the summer, is progressing and it is hoped that all phases will be completed next year. The reason there is a difference in costs and cost analysis for the metro is because they relate to different proposals and projects. It is natural that there would be different cost structures in such an event.

The experience of planning and delivering major infrastructural projects, of which there have been many, has shown that there is scope for improved efficiencies. The Minister and his officials visited Madrid to examine what is recognised in Europe as the most efficient and cost-effective model that exists. This was examined by the Cabinet sub-committee to see if we could learn from the experience in Spain. Measures under construction include shortening and streamlining statutory powers in respect of applications for orders to construct the metro infrastructure and many other issues relating to compensation. The experience is that the rules and regulations that apply in other countries are not the same as those which apply here. That accounts for most of the price differential.

The RPA has responsibility for the Dublin metro project. It is finalising its report based on the experience of Madrid and elsewhere and it will bring that to the Minister during October when the Government will examine the proposal. The Minister for Finance made it clear that the original cost was outside what we could afford in the capital programme, given all the other projects contained therein. It is his obligation to do that. The costs were enormous for one project, which meant we had to examine alternatives, which is what the Government is doing.

Comment on this

Examining alternatives is all very well when one is in Opposition, but when one is in Government, one must make decisions. Given that a consortium awaits a Government decision on this, how much longer must the people and those engaged in the business be kept waiting? There is no doubt that there are differences between proposals. When will the Cabinet make a decision? That is a basic question to which I want an answer. Is this matter on the agenda for the Cabinet meeting tomorrow?

Who does the Taoiseach believe talks sense on this issue? Is it Senator O'Rourke, the Minister for Transport, Deputy Brennan, or the Minister for Finance? Will the Taoiseach, in turn, show some leadership by indicating when he believes a decision will be made, or is the real Taoiseach the Minister for Finance who calls the shots in a similar manner to Gordon Brown in the United Kingdom? Have we lost the Taoiseach and does he now reside in the Department of Finance?

Comment on this

It is always the same during Question Time and Leaders' Questions. One Deputy asks why we give away taxpayers' money while another says we should spend it.

Comment on this

Why does the Government misspend taxpayers' money?

Comment on this

We are trying to obtain the most cost-effective proposal. It is not possible to invest billions of euros in one infrastructural project. The Minister for Finance—

Comment on this

The indemnity deal agreed with the religious congregations was not cost-effective either.

Comment on this

—with the support of the Government was not in a position to fund the metro project, nor was the Minister for Transport asking him to do so. The Minister, Deputy Brennan, is driving this and many other projects forward successfully, in spite of some overruns, especially in Deputy Sargent's constituency where a project had to be entirely altered because he and others were concerned about a few swans which are now quite happy.

Comment on this

We have to continue to try to find the most cost effective system.

Comment on this

Will the Taoiseach make a decision?

Comment on this

The matter will come before Government in the next few weeks when we will make the decision.

Comment on this