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Dáil
‹ Leaders’ Questions.

IMC report and Northern Bank robbery

Summary

Rabbitte asks whether the Independent Monitoring Commission’s report changes the Taoiseach’s position that the IRA carried out the Northern Bank robbery, and calls for meaningful consequences. The Taoiseach says the report will be published later in the week and discusses sanctions and inclusion in the political process.

It is reported in the media that the Government this morning considered the latest report of the Independent Monitoring Commission. Based on what he has seen of the latest report of the IMC, has the Taoiseach any cause to review his earlier statements that the Northern Bank robbery was the work of the provisional IRA and that the leadership of the republican movement had advance knowledge of that? If it is the case that the IMC report has reinforced the Taoiseach's convictions in the matter, why are such conflicting signals coming from the Government? This was an enormous breach of trust. Surely there must be consequences for the people involved, yet conflicting signals are coming from Government. Most recently we were told that when the Taoiseach met the IMC, he encouraged it not to impose any penalties on Sinn Féin. I understand the Minister for Foreign Affairs is or will shortly be in Washington negotiating invitations for the Sinn Féin leadership to the White House St. Patrick's Day celebrations.

Given the IRA statements which were generally accepted by everybody across the board as threatening, does the Taoiseach believe these responses are appropriate? Does he not agree that the democratic parties ought to maintain a consistent position in the light of these threats? More specifically, if the IRA states that all its previous offers are now off the table, is it not entirely reasonable for the Irish Government to make clear that the release of the killers of Detective Garda Jerry McCabe are similarly off the table?

Comment on this

I hope there are no conflicting statements. Somebody handed me a newspaper this morning that I was not aware existed. It contained a number of references to me that I found interesting to the effect that I was backing off in the context of these issues. I understand the title of the newspaper is Daily Ireland.

Comment on this

Was it Senator Mary White who briefed them?

Comment on this

I was told she was an investor in that newspaper but she has informed she is not an investor in any newspaper.

On more serious issues, the Government has seen the IMC report and it will be published later this week. If anything, it will go beyond anything I have said on previous occasions. I will leave people to read this independent report for themselves.

On the issue of sanctions, when these matters were discussed last week and previously, it was mooted in the public domain that had the institutions been up and running, this issue would have brought them down again. That is a fact with which I have no argument. However, I was also asked whether it would be helpful — this was also the thinking of the IMC — if, when the institutions were up and running, people could be suspended from them. That would be entirely unhelpful because it means they would never be up and running. The inclusive institutions would not be up and running if people knew that the day they were up and running they would be suspended. It was in that regard that I said I would not agree with that. The issue of sanctions and exclusion, of blocking people and not engaging with people is a hopeless exercise and will not bring matters forward.

In terms of invitations, the plans for the White House are well advanced. I do not think there will be much discussion on that issue this week. It is a matter for the Americans to announce their decision but, as I understand it, they have made their decision on these matters. These issues have passed and the Americans organise the arrangements for St. Patrick's Day.

On the IRA statement, the Government's position for many years is that we do not comment on such statements, but I do not disagree with what the Deputy said, that one can read these statements as threatening and intimidatory. I shall say some more about that later at the debate this evening.

On the issue of the release of the killers of Jerry McCabe, I answered Deputy Kenny's question. As I said recently, that issue is off the table. I have heard people say in recent days that they have made great efforts to assist the peace process. I tried my best on this one, not only on the murderers of Jerry McCabe but all the other prisoners. I supported the release of several of the prisoners, including a number of people who murdered gardaí, as part of the peace process, and we released them all. We were prepared to go along with what was a demand to try to get a comprehensive agreement. It was not an offer but a demand. I do not want to argue about that, but that is off the table and I do not see it coming back on the table. I said that to Deputy Kenny and I say it again to Deputy Rabbitte.

I recommend that people closely read the statement. I understand Deputy Rabbitte raising the question of where we are trying to go, but at the same time in all these issues one can go back into the cul-de-sac. There are times when people like being in the cul-de-sac and then they all shout "wolf", "hostage", "victim", and so on, but that is not helpful. We have to try to work on from this. While all of these issues are terrible, we have to get to an end and we have to continue to work at the process. It is not a question of changing or being soft, we have to try to find a way to move on. I do not see an easy way of moving on at present. I do not see a way of getting the trust and confidence. I do not know how we will do that but I do not want to get ourselves painted into a position.

We have to mark where we are and the IMC in its report will do that. Somebody on the Deputy's side referred to confirming the confirmation, and it is beyond doubt. I will let the Deputy read the report. The Government has no position on changing the report. We made many recommendations and we accept the report. We have to try to see where we can move in the future. I am conscious, as is Deputy Rabbitte, that the marching season will come upon us and that brings its own problems and tensions, of which we must be mindful. Community leaders in Northern Ireland are asking me to be mindful of that, but it does not remove any of the issues we have debated here in recent weeks and which will be totally collaborated in the IMC report this week.

Comment on this

Judging from what the Taoiseach has said, there is no ambiguity and no doubt about the clarity of the conclusions in the report of the Independent Monitoring Commission. I hear what the Taoiseach says about no sanctions and no penalties, but surely there must be consequences. It cannot be a case of business as usual, otherwise we will be back again in five or six months' time in a similar position. As regards exclusion and inclusion, the Labour Party agrees with the Taoiseach on an inclusive process but there is no room for threats in an inclusive process. In terms of exclusion, will care be taken on this occasion to ensure parties such as the SDLP, which was at the architectural stage of the peace process, will be included as well as the UUP, the Alliance and so on? I know the Taoiseach will say he met them but when the serious negotiations start, parties such as the SDLP which can claim more than the average share of authorship of the process will say they were excluded when the real business was being done and that what was in prospect of being signed off was, therefore, inferior.

I heard what the Taoiseach said about the release of the killers of Jerry McCabe in this new situation and I welcome that.

Comment on this

I think we all agree with the politics of inclusion. In the last round of discussions in April 2003 and October 2003 the SDLP and the UUP were working together and others were excluded. They were not totally excluded, but the key issues were the two parties. On 8 December the DUP and Sinn Féin were involved because their mandates put them in that position under the Good Friday Agreement. As regards people being excluded, it was only when we were dealing with issues that other parties had nothing to do with that they were excluded. What the Deputy said about the SDLP is correct, and without the SDLP we would not have had a Good Friday Agreement. We would probably have had nothing in Northern Ireland. Of course, the SDLP has to be kept fully involved at all times and our policy is to do that. That party does not bring anything to the table and neither would it want to in terms of decommissioning and all the other issues we were trying to deal with in putting arms beyond use.

Deputy Rabbitte asked what is the penalty. The penalty is clear. As we stand today, there is no possibility whatsoever of making progress on the peace and confidence that leads to an inclusive working executive and administration in Northern Ireland under the terms of the Good Friday Agreement unless the Sinn Féin leadership comes back to both the Irish Government and the British Government, as requested, to give us answers about the three areas on which we asked for answers, that is, paramilitarism in all its effects and particularly the issues of decommissioning and criminality. I do not think, even if we get answers, we will be able to move fast, but we certainly cannot move in the short term without those answers.

Comment on this