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Dáil
‹ Leaders’ Questions.

HSE software contracts

Summary

Kenny questioned the approval and value of HSE software contracts, including iSoft, iEPR and Lorenzo. The Taoiseach said several contracts were under examination and promised to provide details after Professor Drumm’s report.

On 5 October this year, the Taoiseach assured the House that all IT projects within the Health Service Executive would be reviewed, including a contract with a company called iSoft. The project in question was mentioned again in the newspapers this weekend when it emerged that there had been no consultation between the Health Service Executive and either general practitioners or hospitals on the purchase of the software in question. It has also emerged that while the Department of Finance has sanctioned two packages — iEPR, the electronic patient records system, and Lorenzo, a patient management system — it has withheld sanction for the roll-out of the Lorenzo package.

The questions I want to ask the Taoiseach relate to the circumstances in which the iSoft contract was signed. My information is that the contract, worth €56 million, was signed on Saturday, 30 April 2005. This was done following the Department of Finance granting oral sanction for the signing of the contract to the acting director for IT in the Health Service Executive on 29 April. Is it true that this contract was only signed after high-level emergency meetings involving officials from the Department of the Taoiseach, the Office of the Attorney General and the Department of Health and Children? Can the Taoiseach explain why a contract of this significance was signed on a Saturday? Why was it based on oral sanction and what was the rush? I am quite sure the Taoiseach's excellent officials have prepared for him a long document on the value on these IT systems but I would prefer if he answered the specific questions on the circumstances in which the contract was signed.

Comment on this

I will do as Deputy Kenny asked and will not give a long description of the benefits of all these contracts which are necessary in the system. I understand some of the contracts were signed following consultation and some were signed after very long consultations with the companies and having regard to tendering arrangements with the companies. Some of the contracts that were signed were subject to a prolonged period of roll-out and a check was not carried out on them each year. I do not have the details on the contract pertaining to Easter of this year.

When he attended the Joint Committee on Health and Children recently, Professor Drumm stated it was the Health Service Executive's assessment that he and his management team would reconsider all these contracts, not only recent contracts but those of the past few years. The purpose of that is, first, to ascertain whether the contracts were necessary — he made the assumption that they were necessary — second, to find out whether the executive should have a better mechanism for considering the roll-out and in particular to find whether it was delivering what it sought to deliver in the first place, third, to ensure that all the proper arrangements in regard to accountability and management procedures were put in place and, fourth, to ensure that the Departments of Finance and Health and Children were fully engaged with the executive. Professor Drumm said he would report back on all these issues, including with regard to the Comptroller and Auditor General. Obviously, he would not cover the contract of last April referred to by Deputy Kenny. We await that report and until we know all the details, I have no more to say on the matter.

Comment on this

I noticed that, coincidentally, the Taoiseach gave some exclusive interviews at the weekend.

Comment on this

So did the Deputy.

Comment on this

The Taoiseach did not answer any of the questions I asked. Why was this contract signed on the basis of oral sanction only? Why was it signed on a Saturday? Why was it necessary to have high level emergency meetings between officials from the Department of the Taoiseach, the Attorney General's office, the HSE and the Department of Health and Children with regard to it being signed? Why, if the Department of Finance gave oral sanction to purchase these two software packages, has the same Department refused the roll-out of the Lorenzo package?

We have witnessed an obscene wastage of public money, particularly in the Department of Health and Children. General practitioners protested yesterday outside Tralee hospital in Tralee at the lack of beds and that 10,000 operations were cancelled this year. Will the Taoiseach, in answering these questions, assure me that the Government was not put under pressure by iSoft to sign this contract on or before 30 April? Will he assure the House that the apparent rush to sign the contract on 30 April was in no way related to the fact that iSoft's financial year ended on 30 April?

Comment on this

When Professor Drumm and his colleagues report on the details of all the individual contracts, I will provide the information based on that report. A number of these matters and a number of contracts are under examination by the Departments of Finance and Health and Children, the HSE and Professor Drumm. While they are being examined there is no point in my pre-empting those discussions. These questions have been raised by the Department of Finance. Many of the contracts have long-term roll-outs, although not the April contract. The contracts are necessary and are not a waste of money. However, they must be benchmarked to see whether they are delivering what is required. We will have a full report from the HSE before Christmas and we should consider the facts on that basis.

The general practitioners protesting outside Tralee hospital are demanding a fair share of resources. The HSE and hospital management are available to discuss the concerns of GPs and I understand those matters are under consideration. A number of new developments are ongoing in the area, including the development of a new emergency department and an ambulatory care unit, and construction of a palliative care unit at the hospital. However, it is clear that GPs are aggrieved. To address their concerns it is proposed to establish a GP liaison group which will include consultant medical staff, hospital management, GP representatives and the community services section of the HSE.

With regard to the number of cancellations, the figures released by the HSE show that 10,368 operations were postponed, not cancelled, for various reasons in the first six months of the year.

Comment on this