Deputy Halligan should be allowed to make his point.

Thank you, a Cheann Comhairle.

The Government would need to cap itself somewhere.

Deputy Ellis should keep the needs out of it.

Would the Deputies mind not interrupting and give Deputy Halligan a chance to speak?

I was contacted in recent days by the owner of a well-known equestrian centre in the south east, Stonehaven. It had run into arrears of €3,000 on a bank loan following a downturn in business. The lady had successfully paid more than two thirds of her repayments last year and continued to make regular, albeit reduced payments, on the loan. However, last week a tractor – crucial to the day-to-day functioning of the business - was repossessed.

I will briefly outline the facts. This was not a company that had washed its hands of debt. It had already paid €42,000 of a €52,000 loan and was making efforts to catch up on the arrears owed despite a substantial decline in business. However, the bank service agent was not happy and, accordingly, arrived in the yard and took the tractor. It is staggering that a viable company that employs 15 people is in jeopardy based on arrears of €3,000 while 167 former bank executives are on pensions of more than €100,000 per annum.

I have been in politics for 15 years. I topped the poll twice as a councillor and I have been mayor of Waterford. I am the only Deputy elected from Waterford city. I say that because I meet hundreds of ordinary people – small businesspeople and others in business - every week who tell me that the Government has badly underestimated the anger, infuriation and resentment at how the banks treated people and are still treating people. It is a barometer of what is happening all over the country. Let us cut to the chase - advising banks to issue letters to their senior executives seeking cuts to pensions will not achieve anything. A substantial number of those individuals are responsible for the state of the country.

We are way over time. Could the Deputy please put his question?

They have not taken any hit. Will the Government bring forward legislation to force executives of the bailed-out banks to take a cut in their Rolls Royce retirement schemes? If the Government were to do that the entire country would support it. The Government has repeatedly pointed to the constitutional barriers to the reduction of top-level pensions. Will the Government investigate whether a referendum is required to alter the Constitution in order to make the bankers reduce their pensions? Does the Government not understand what is happening throughout this country?

The Deputy is over time. He should please resume his seat.

The Government is not listening to what people are saying or it believes the banks.

Hear, hear.

Somewhere along the line something has gone wrong when a business could be put to the wall by a bank because of arrears of €3,000 and 15 jobs could be put in jeopardy.

The Deputy has made his point. Will he please resume his seat?

The banks have busted this country.

Hear, hear.

The Deputy should please allow the Minister to reply.

He made his point well.

I did not ask Deputy Healy-Rae for his comments. Would he mind please not interrupting?

I am entitled to my opinion.

Deputy Halligan did make his point well. It is a fair point. Many businesses in this country have not got fair treatment from banks in recent years. We are trying to rebuild a broken banking system and to force banks to get back into the banking business. That is something they had moved away from as they moved into the business of speculation which was part of the problem in this country.

I am not qualified to comment on the individual case as this is the first I have heard of it. However, it seems to be totally unreasonable to repossess farm machinery on the back of arrears of €3,000. I assume the case is more complex than that. Deputy Halligan must be joking to suggest that anyone on this side of the House is not familiar with the difficulties faced by small businesses at the moment. Everyone on this side of the House hears those stories all of the time. Given that we are in government people expect us to try to respond to them so we hear the stories as much as the Deputy does. We are more than aware of the situation which is why we have driven reform in the banking system and will continue to set targets and ensure they are met in terms of the level of lending. We will also introduce the necessary legislation to try to ease people’s debt management burdens.

On the issue of pay in banks, it is important to state that in many ways it is a separate issue. If one were to cut pay in banks, which many would like to see, it would not necessarily mean one would change banking practice in this country. We must do two things. First, make sure that the demands we make of bankers in this country at a senior level are appropriate to the conditions in which we find ourselves. That is why the Government has not broken the cap it set on bank salaries – unlike the previous Government. There has been much coverage in newspapers on the CEO of Bank of Ireland whose contract was put in place in 2009 when a cap did not apply. Since we took office we applied a cap of €500,000 and will continue to do so.

In recent weeks the Government has also made a clear statement to the pillar banks that we want to see a reduction in the salary costs within the banks of between 6% and 10%. We look forward to proposals in that regard from the banks concerned. I assume senior management in those banks will lead by example on any cuts that will apply in the months ahead.