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Dáil
‹ Leaders' Questions

Local property tax on ghost estates

Summary

Mary Lou McDonald condemns the local property tax as unfair to mortgage-distressed families and unfinished ghost-estate residents, asking whether exemptions will be revisited. The Taoiseach defends the tax and outlines the criteria for seriously problematic estates, while the exchange becomes a dispute over comparisons with Northern Ireland and criticism of Minister Phil Hogan.

Yesterday, Sinn Féin published legislation providing for the abolition of the family home tax.

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The Deputy's party is implementing it in the North.

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This tax is lifted straight out of Fianna Fáil's four-year plan. It is the latest blow that this Government has delivered to hard-pressed families. One in four mortgage holders are in distress, yet he asks the same families to pay this unfair tax. It takes no account of ability to pay, negative equity, mortgages in arrears, or indeed the thousands of euro that many have already paid in stamp duty.

Last week we learnt that homes in ghost estates will also be levied with this tax. Only 5,100 houses will be exempt, compared with the 43,000 which were exempted from the household charge. It was a "stupid decision", "ham-fisted", "unfair", a "complete mess". These are not my words but those of some of the Taoiseach's Labour Party colleagues in government.

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That was Deputy Stagg.

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Does the Taoiseach accept that the Government has made a mess of this issue? Does he accept that it is fundamentally unfair for families living in unfinished ghost estates to be hit with this tax? Can he indicate whether the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Phil Hogan, is revisiting the issue of ghost estates and the payment of this tax? Does he accept that many families in this State will be pushed over the edge, over their own fiscal cliff, by the Government's insistence on imposing this tax?

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Deputy's party has not made the same case in Northern Ireland where property taxes apply and its representatives support these on the basis of the provision of local services. The local property tax is for the purpose of contributing to the provision of public services for people all over the country. The mechanics of the tax have been worked out by the Revenue Commissioners. Half of it is due in 2013 and full payment in 2014. People in various parts of the country will receive letters concerning the tax over the next several weeks.

Last year, in respect of the €100 household charge, there were blanket exemptions given to many housing estates, of which there were 43,000 houses mentioned. Of that figure, 20,000 houses were empty and uninhabited. It was not a true reflection of an exemption because there was nothing paid in respect of these houses. Of the remainder, there are 5,000 to 6,000 houses in estates where remedial works have been carried out. This is a far more accurate assessment of who is actually liable for the property tax for this and next year.

The Deputy will also be aware that 65% of these will apply for local areas in 2013. She is also aware that housing estates that were given blanket exemptions in respect of the household charge were started in different stages. One might have the front element of an estate finished with the middle section incomplete and the back section not even started. An entire estate may have been given an exemption in the first place.

The Minister of State, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, clarified all of this last week with up-to-date accurate information. There are opportunities for people who own such houses to contribute in a variety of fashions to the services to be provided in their local areas.

It is not unusual for Deputy McDonald to come into the Chamber claiming this is unfair and unjust, yet up the road a few miles she finds a similar tax fair and just.

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Given that the Taoiseach refers to it so often, I would have expected him to do his homework and familiarise himself with the significant difference between the system of rating in the North and the tax on the family home he is proposing. For instance in the North, citizens do not pay for their bin collection. There is no suggestion of people paying for domestic water. People have provision of schoolbooks for their children and so forth. I am sure the Taoiseach knows this. However, he bounces this ball to try and distract from his own shortcomings and the reality as it pertains in this State.

The Taoiseach asks us to believe that Deputy Hogan, the magician Minister, has magically resolved the issues pertaining to ghost estates. That simply is not the case. I saw the Taoiseach was out on the ground in Meath East recently. I am sure if he had taken the trouble to talk to the many people who live in such estates there, they would have set out clearly how realities have not changed from one year to another. The Taoiseach, however, is quite satisfied to ask people who cannot afford this additional tax, those on welfare payments and pensions to pay it. He is quite satisfied to allow Revenue to reach into their pockets. He is quite happy to preside over a situation where people living in little more than building sites will be asked to pay this tax.

However, the Taoiseach's candidate in the current Meath East by-election says differently. She claims, on the Taoiseach's behalf I imagine, that the Minister, Deputy Phil Hogan, and the Government will revisit this issue and examine the criteria again. I can only take from the Taoiseach's response this afternoon that the candidate in question has been misled on that score. Is the Taoiseach insisting that those who have suffered the stress, inconvenience and hardship of living in unfinished and ghost estates must cough up with everyone else to pay this unfair tax?

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Deputy McDonald has attempted to change the household charge into a property tax. The first lesson she should learn is that they are different things.

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It is a bondholders' tax.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The second issue is that the refuse charge and the property charge in the Republic will still be very much less than the taxes imposed in Northern Ireland, which are on average three times greater. Deputy McDonald should do her own homework on her friends and supporters up there as to what they are actually paying.

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The Taoiseach should do his homework.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I am not at all happy that Deputy McDonald should know whether I am happy or not about issues such as this. She does not need to put words in my mouth. She has been doing that for years with other parties and other individuals.

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The Taoiseach did not look too happy yesterday with that big fellow in front of him. He was looking at his shirt pocket.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Deputy McDonald does not speak for me or the Fine Gael Party.

In respect of the household charge last year, the survey carried out in 2012 was purely and objectively based on the actual state of completion of a development. It expressly included estates deemed by local authorities to have seriously problematic conditions, regardless of whether the developer was on or off the site. This year a clear definition of seriously problematic estates includes issues such as installation and commissioning of public lighting, the provision of drinking water supply, provision of wastewater collection, treatment and disposal systems.

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There are estates in question that have not been taken over by local authorities.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

It also includes issues such as having an access road to at least a base course level including, where required, provision for parking and provision of access to the dwelling by a constructed footpath. These are issues that are deemed to be seriously problematic.

It ill behoves the Deputy to cast aspersions on one of the most brilliant young candidates I have seen in any election, Helen McEntee.

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I was not casting aspersions on her but on the Minister, Deputy Phil Hogan.

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The Taoiseach has led her astray.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

She comes from a particular stock. As we spoke so eloquently of her late father, I can assure Deputy McDonald that, but for his persistence and commitment, the issue of pyrite-affected houses might never have seen the progress it has made now.

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Deputies

Hear, hear.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Depending on the decision of the people of Meath East tomorrow, if Ms McEntee is elected as a Government Deputy, she will, of course, be quite entitled to lobby the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government in respect of these conditions for any estate in east Meath as might apply.

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Will he listen to her, though?

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She can lobby all she likes but will he listen?

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

Deputies, please.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

It is open to any Government Deputy or any other Deputy to make a case in that regard. I hope Deputy McDonald might reflect upon the aspersions she has cast upon a brilliant young candidate with a very bright future.

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I was casting aspersions on the Taoiseach and the Minister, Deputy Phil Hogan.

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