Yesterday, the heads of the protection of life during pregnancy Bill were discussed in the House. It was condemned by some as a positive compromise and condemned by others as not going far enough. I suggest both approaches are seriously flawed. The very content of the Bill in its current form undermines the very rights it sets out to protect.

Who wrote that for you?

Did Deputy Clare Daly help with it?

I waited with the greatest respect and I hope to get respect. I want to speak on behalf of people who have a different view.

Please, allow the Deputy to put his question.

On a point of order, this goes on all the time and it is wrong.

I will deal with it. I ask Deputies to stay quiet.

You are not all-----

Stay quiet, Deputy Lawlor, please, and I will not ask you a second time.

It never happened when Deputy Martin was in government.

What is going on is wrong. Deputies should be allowed have two minutes to ask a question. The Deputies opposite are shouting down democracy.

I ask Deputy Martin to please allow me do my job-----

I will indeed, but with respect, it is not what is happening.

-----and he can do his.

They are interrupting all the time.

I had to write to the Ceann Comhairle last week. He does his best always, but we are not being allowed to speak and it is not fair on us over here.

I am looking after it.

Go raibh maith agat. The Bill does this by framing proposed legislation which completely ignores the weight of medical evidence which demonstrates beyond reasonable doubt that abortion as a treatment for suicide is harmful to women and favours an ideological position not supported by facts. It is also proposed that certain hospitals will be designated to perform these so-called terminations. What will be the position if the hospital refuses to perform these terminations? What if it conflicts with the established ethos of these hospitals as set down in many cases by contractual agreements between the HSE and the hospitals? The Bill contains a conscientious objection clause for individuals, but will the same apply to institutions which cannot in conscience perform these procedures? I suspect this is one more demonstration that the Bill is profoundly unworkable and risks an enormous level of Government intrusion into the practice and integrity of our health system. The entire situation speaks to the lack of equality between the life of the mother and the child as laid out in Article 40.3.3° of the Constitution. The Bill also requires that the abortion can only be granted in the reasonable opinion of two psychiatrists that the risk can only be averted by this procedure. It is asking psychiatrists for a reasonable opinion despite the fact the majority of them have stated this is unreasonable.

As the Deputy and the House know, the Government has approved the heads of a Bill which is intended to protect the lives of women during pregnancy. Every year, thousands of women in Ireland give birth. It is a happy occasion and a cause of great joy. However, there are occasions when things go wrong, and in these cases women are entitled to know they will get the treatment which will save their lives, and the doctors who treat them also need to know their position is clear when they take action to save a woman's life during pregnancy. The heads of the Bill will be referred to the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children. I invite Deputy McGrath to put the case he has made and the issues he has raised to the committee and take the opportunity when the Bill is before the House to make the case he has made. There will be a full debate on the Bill in the House. There will be a full discussion on the heads of the Bill at the Oireachtas committee and there will be plenty of opportunities for Deputy McGrath to make the points he has made and have them responded to by the Minister.

I am a member of the health committee and I was at the meeting this morning. I will make these points at the committee also. I hope the committee will not just be a stalking horse for the legislation and that we, and those who come before us, will be listened to. What persuaded the Tánaiste to include a provision for psychiatrists to arrive at a position which they have stated is not supported by evidence? In practice, will this not seriously limit the pool of mental health professionals who will participate in such a process and thus leave the door open to the tiny minority who believe abortion will serve the interests of women?

The evidence from every other jurisdiction in the world has demonstrated time and again that despite the best intentions of legislators, and regardless of the alleged restrictiveness of legislation, no government has succeeded in preventing an abortion on demand situation from occurring once the principle of targeting innocent human life is accepted. I say this honestly. An appeals mechanism on behalf of suicidal women refused an abortion is contained in the heads of the Bill. Since the unborn child has equal right to life will there be room for an appeal on behalf of the unborn child in the event two psychiatrists in the teeth of the relevant evidence sign the child's life away? Will the Tánaiste give a commitment to this in the interests of equality?

When the Committee on Health and Children held its hearings on this issue earlier this year, it did so in a very dignified and reasoned way. I expect that, in considering the content of the heads of the Bill, the committee will address it in the same reasoned way. As I said yesterday, it is important that this debate be conducted in a reasonable manner. Deputy Mattie McGrath has a point of view on the Bill and he will have plenty of opportunity to air his views at the Committee on Health and Children, of which he is a member, and in the debate here in the House. Those are the appropriate places for the issues he has raised this morning to be teased out in detail.

The Bill has been worked on for some time and is balanced and reasonable. It is within the confines of the constitutional provision, the judgment in the X case, and the judgment given by the European Court of Human Rights. There are obviously details that have to be, and will be, discussed here on the floor of the House and at the committee, including the issues that Deputy McGrath has raised this morning. In fairness, that is probably the best place to have that matter discussed. That is what the Oireachtas is for - to debate and discuss the detail of legislative proposals. I expect there will be plenty of opportunity to have the issues which Deputy McGrath raised - which related to detailed provisions in the Bill - fully teased out. There will be plenty of opportunity for that to be done.