Today, we will commence statements on the report by Mr. Guerin. However, I wish to step back a couple of weeks to revisit the account of events given by An Taoiseach in respect of his knowledge of the revelations of the practice of taping phone calls to and from Garda stations. Those matters are the subject of a separate commission of investigation led by Mr. Justice Fennelly.

An Taoiseach has stated on the public record that he was first informed of the taping practice on Sunday evening, 23 March, when during a phone conversation with the Attorney General on an unrelated matter, she raised the issue. The Taoiseach then said that on Monday 24 March he met the Minister for Justice and Equality and Brian Purcell, Secretary General at the Department of Justice and Equality, and that he asked Mr. Purcell to go to see the Garda Commissioner at his home. We all know that this meeting resulted directly in the subsequent resignation of the Garda Commissioner.

It strikes me that the Tánaiste was left out of the loop in that sequence of events, and that was confirmed again by the subsequent developments around the resignation of the former Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Shatter. I will say no more about that.

I have obtained, through a freedom of information request, the Taoiseach’s diary from the week in question. It does indeed refer to a meeting or conversation with the Attorney General on Sunday evening, 23 March, at 5.30 p.m. to be precise. However, it also contains a reference to an earlier meeting on that Sunday and it reflects that at 7.30 a.m. the Taoiseach met the Minister for Justice and Equality and his officials. The Taoiseach has made no reference whatsoever to that meeting in his public account of the events or in his account to the Dáil.

Could the Deputy ask a question please?

A number of questions arise. Was the Tánaiste aware of the meeting? Did the Taoiseach inform him of it? Could he tell us which officials from the Department of Justice and Equality were present at the meeting? Was Brian Purcell there? Could he tell us what was discussed at the meeting? Was the taping of phone calls to and from Garda stations discussed? Was the fate of the Garda Commissioner discussed? Might that explain the marked reluctance of Brian Purcell to deal with the matter before the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality?

It seems to me that they are all questions Deputy McDonald should usefully put to the Taoiseach. I do not keep the Taoiseach’s diary. I do not know what meetings he did or did not have on Sunday 23 March. With the greatest respect, Deputy McDonald should ask him directly about those issues.

What I do know is that the Government took the question of the taping of conversations in Garda stations very seriously. I had an opportunity to address questions on the issue previously. I made the point that it is very serious from the point of view of people whose conversations were taped and of gardaí whose conversations might have been taped without their knowledge. From what we were told at the time, there were a number of taped conversations. What we have done in respect of that is to establish a formal commission of investigation which is chaired by Mr. Justice Nial Fennelly. It was established very quickly by the Government on 1 April, very shortly after the information came to light. The commission has been asked to report back by the end of the year. A Supplementary Estimate to ensure the commission is able to do its work was passed by this House, and I have no doubt the commission will in any event examine some of the various issues raised by Deputy McDonald this morning.

It is very clear that not alone does the Tánaiste not keep the Taoiseach’s diary, he is clearly not informed or perhaps kept abreast of some of the significant meetings that take place within the diary. I am sure he will agree with me that it is very important for the purpose of public confidence, but also for the purpose of the confidence of Members of the Dáil, that we are sure a full account of events as they transpired is given in the House. People watching as the sequence of events unfolded remarked at the fact that there were information gaps. The view was that things that were wildly implausible were placed on the record of the House and insisted upon as a full account of events.

I have the diary and it says that at 7.30 a.m. on the Sunday the Taoiseach met the Minister for Justice and Equality, who was just back from Mexico, and his officials. I assume that Brian Purcell, being the most senior official, was present at the meeting. The Tánaiste clearly had no notice and no knowledge of the meeting. That is an issue of concern for him. Given the seriousness of those matters, I would have thought he would have forensically trawled through the sequence of events, and who met who and when, with the Taoiseach. That is what I would have done if I were in his position.

Will the Tánaiste establish for us the following facts? Why was the meeting scheduled so early on a Sunday morning? It is not part of the Taoiseach’s routine to meet officials at 7.30 a.m. on a Sunday. We know that because we have his diary. Did the meeting take place? It is in the Taoiseach’s diary so we presume it did. Who was at the meeting? What was discussed at the meeting? Was the taping of phone calls discussed? Were issues relating to Commissioner Callinan discussed? Crucially, why is it that in all the Taoiseach has had to say on these matters to “put Paddy in the picture”, as he would put it, this particular meeting has been edited out of his script? Does the Tánaiste agree it is a matter of concern for Members of the Dáil and for the Tánaiste if a meeting at that level was held at the time and he knew nothing about it and neither did we and the Dáil was not informed of it?

The taping of conversations in Garda stations, which is what this is about, is now the subject-----

No, this is about-----

Please.

I will get to the meeting in due course. The taping of conversations in Garda stations is the subject of a commission of investigation. It behoves us all to let the commission of investigation, which is being chaired by a Supreme Court judge, to get on with its work.

Deputy McDonald asked me to account for what is in the Taoiseach’s diary and meetings he had. I am no more in a position to do that than she is to account for what is in her party leader’s diary. I cannot tell her – I do not know if she knows what meetings her party leader might have had, who he might have met, what time and whether she has access to his diary. If she has questions-----

That is a non-answer.

Please.

If Deputy McDonald has questions, she like everyone else is perfectly entitled to make a freedom of information request and to get the diary of the Taoiseach, my diary or that of any other Minister. That is what is available under freedom of information.

With the greatest of respect, if the Deputy then has detailed questions about meetings the Taoiseach, I or any other Minister had, the person to whom the questions should be put is the person whose diary the Deputy has-----

Did the Tánaiste not put this question to him?

We are over time.

The Deputy is using a very clever politically-motivated approach to the questioning. If the Deputy has questions to ask the Taoiseach about his diary she should come in here and ask him questions about the diary and he will answer them.

Does the Tánaiste have questions to ask him?

Does the Tánaiste have any concerns about it?