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Dáil
‹ Leaders' Questions

Jobstown incident and Tánaiste condemnation

Summary

Deputy Cowen condemns the incident involving the Tánaiste in Jobstown; she thanks supporters, describes the distress caused and defends the local community and Gardaí.

I add my voice to those of others who condemned what happened to the Tánaiste in Jobstown last week. Despite our differences in this Chamber, every Deputy, of all parties and none, should be singing from the same hymn sheet in condemning what occurred. I hope we do not see these events repeated in the future.

I have no doubt that the Government is breathing a sigh of relief after yesterday's massive climb-down on water charges. I note that the Tánaiste stated last night that she had appointed the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Alan Kelly, to sort out the issue. I am glad to see that the Labour Party has taken ownership of Irish Water, which was a Fine Gael love child.

Yesterday the Government inflicted on the people a package of measures which will mean that everything collected in water charges in the next eight years will go towards the €700 million wasted to date. I wonder if yesterday's announcement answered the many outstanding questions. It failed, for example, to convince people that establishing Irish Water was the right thing to do or that they could expect it to suddenly become efficient, cost-conscious and consumer-friendly. It confirmed, however, that one element of the model the Government has pursued to date was definitely off the agenda, namely, conservation.

I am mindful of the comments made by the Minister for Health, Deputy Leo Varadkar, the other night and those made by the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Brendan Howlin, yesterday. This morning a former chairman of the Economic and Social Research Institute expressed concern about the independence of Irish Water and its ability to reach the Holy Grail of borrowing off-balance sheet to the extent the Government would like. What level of contact has the Government had with EUROSTAT? Given that under the revised model, the Government subvention will increase to €240 million, €180 million will be handed back in rebates and a €60 million supplement will be paid to the local authorities in order that Irish Water does not have to pay rates on the €11 billion worth of assets it has acquired, what reassurance has the Government received from EUROSTAT that its model passes the test? If it does not pass the test, what assurances have been given to the Government and what guarantees can it provide that it will pass the test? The House would be wiser if it had answers to these questions. As far as I am concerned, the Government's decision to revise the model by increasing the subvention and decreasing the contribution of members of the public does nothing more than put the rest of the House on a general election footing.

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The Tánaiste should do the sums again.

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I thank Deputy Barry Cowen for his kind remarks. I have been contacted by a large number of people from around the country and living abroad and I express my thanks to all of them. The issue was not about me, in particular, but about the 60 young people who were graduating on the day. Their community and An Cosán are very proud of them, whereas the people leading the protest did not seem to have a care for them.

With regard to the people of Tallaght, especially Jobstown, I attended a large event the other day involving schools in Jobstown and Tallaght generally. The second year students in attendance were very proud and well turned out. They hope one day to go to Trinity College Dublin or one of the other universities and colleges under the Access programme. One could not but be proud of them. The protestors and those who led the protests did no favours to the young people who were present.

If Irish Water is Fine Gael's love child, as Deputy Barry Cowen describes it, the Fianna Fáil Party had a hand in its conception because it left-----

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It is a hybrid.

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Who delivered the baby?

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While we all understand the pressure the previous Government was under, Irish Water had been left on the to-do list signed with the troika.

As I said, however, I do not really want to get into an argy-bargy with the Deputy. I thank him for his remarks, because it is comforting, particularly with regard to my staff person who was with me in the car and had a very frightening experience and who was understandably extremely upset. The gardaí took grief, particularly women gardaí. Over-sexualised imagery was being used in the protests and comments were made as well, particularly to young male gardaí.

As regards Irish Water, Deputy Cowen asked about the status of EUROSTAT, which is similar to our Central Statistics Office, CSO. These are august, independent organisations and, as any economist and anybody who has served in government will tell the Deputy, they make their own decisions. For instance, the CSO publishes regular figures in Ireland in respect of economic activity, employment figures, unemployment figures and so on. All of these statistical bodies are resolutely independent, so there is no way the Irish Government will know the decision until such time as, in its own professional way, EUROSTAT, under EU law - and, indeed, the CSO under Irish law - takes its decision, which I understand will be some time at the end of the first quarter of 2015.

Under the market corporation test, the so-called MCT, the Government subvention as a percentage of the total is 44%. There is a small change in the subvention level, as the CEO of Ervia and Irish Water set out on "Prime Time" last night - a change of around €21 million in respect of the rates which would formerly have been paid, potentially, by Irish Water. It should be remembered that the property and assets that were taken over are those of local authorities and, as such, rates were never paid on them. Therefore, an arrangement has essentially been made to continue that. The CEO said it made no material difference, but the difference this sounding model does make - and I know the Deputy appreciates it - is that instead of having the funding costs of Irish Water directly in our annual capital budgets, we can use the ESB and Bord Gáis model to raise funds via the selling of debt and bonds, largely to pension funds of workers throughout the world, including Ireland and elsewhere in the EU, when their pension funds choose to invest in a public utility such as Irish Water. Essentially, it is a way of making Ireland's investment capacity go further. We have done it for decades and we raised billions via the ESB and Bord Gáis. We are simply using the same model now, which means that we have more money to put into school buildings, hospitals, roads and all the other things that, understandably, everybody in this House is looking for nationally and at a local level.

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