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Dáil
‹ Leaders' Questions

Hospital overcrowding and patient charges

Summary

Gerry Adams cited a baby’s 11-hour wait in Cork University Hospital and a Drogheda patient charged for trolley care, arguing that Government policy was creating a chaotic, two-tier health service. The Taoiseach defended increased health funding, said the Drogheda charge had been waived, and pointed to flexibility in medical-card applications while trading personal criticisms with Adams.

I spoke this morning with Daniel Long who is the father of Orlaith, a little six-week old baby girl who was forced to wait 11 hours in the accident and emergency department of Cork University Hospital for a bed. Orlaith, with her father and mother, Debbie Looney, was referred to hospital as she was unable to hold her bottle down. She kept getting sick and she showed signs of dehydration. She was admitted to the accident and emergency department at 11.20 p.m. on Sunday, 22 November but she only got a bed at 10.30 a.m. the following day. Is it not an indictment of the Government's stewardship of our health service that a six-week old child and her parents were put through such an ordeal? Is it not particularly so because such unfairness to citizens like Orlaith is no longer unusual on the Taoiseach's watch? It is the norm.

He promised to reform our health service, to end the scandal of patients on trolleys and to end the two-tier system of unequal access to health care. He also promised free GP care for all, an end to prescription charges and the abolition of the HSE but he has delivered none of this. In fairness, he never promised universal health care because he is opposed to it and that is why Orlaith ended up on a trolley, why 25 out of 29 accident and emergency departments have seen increased overcrowding and why there are delayed discharges, a shortage of home care packages and a lack of nursing home beds. The Government is responsible for a health service in complete chaos. Is Orlaith's disturbing case not further evidence that the Government has no intention of adequately resourcing the health service and bringing in universal health care?

Comment on this
Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Deputy is wrong again. The Government concluded the Supplementary Estimate for health this morning, which is a serious increase on what was there for the past number of years. That is all aimed, within the prudent management of the economy, at attempting to provide the best level of service we can for patients. The Government remains committed to universal health care and the provision of a single tier system. We introduced free GP care for all those under six and over 70. The next part of that strategy is to provide free GP care for the children of all working families. I do not accept the Deputy's assertions at all.

The point the Deputy made about the little baby is real and I empathise completely with the parents in the case whose child was sent to the hospital by the general practitioner because she was dehydrated. What can one say about the fears, anxieties and concerns of parents, particularly in respect of a young baby? CUH is carrying out an investigation into why this child was on a trolley for 11 hours. I am glad to note little baby Orlaith is recovering well at home and making good progress. That is something everyone will appreciate. I do not know the reasons the little child was left on a trolley for that length of time. The hospital management has asked the question and an investigation is being carried out in that regard.

In general, accident and emergency departments are a priority in dealing with the question of overcrowding, which happens for a variety of reasons, as the Deputy will be well aware. A total of 450 additional beds are being opened to relieve that pressure. These are either new beds or ones that were previously closed, with 200 having opened to date and the remainder due to open in the next few weeks before the end of the year. It is imperative in that regard that all relevant parts of the health service, including acute, community and primary care, make the best use the resources at their disposal in respect of dealing with this particular problem.

In respect of the question the Deputy raised initially, I am glad the little child is recovering well and I am sorry that she was on a trolley for those hours. I expect that the management of the hospital will respond to the Minister and the HSE as to why that happened.

Comment on this

I have no doubt the Taoiseach is sorry but that is not good enough. He is five years in that seat as the Taoiseach of a Government which made all these promises. This morning, I also spoke to Denise Tuohy who has been told that she has to pay €75 a day for being on a trolley in Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital, Drogheda. Denise spent four days in hospital. To make matters worse, her son, Jake, has a rare genetic condition and he does not have a medical card. He is five years old but he only has a GP visit card.

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What about the free care for those under six?

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Denise now owes €700 in medical bills. She told me that the nurses were fabulous but the system is letting patients down and she is right.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

A question, please.

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I will not be long.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

I thank the Deputy.

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She says she feels degraded. She has worked all her life and she has paid taxes. She says this is not about her; it is about older people and youngsters like her son, Jake. She is being released from hospital this afternoon and then she has to bring her son to the doctor.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

A question, please. We are over time.

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If she has to bring him to the hospital, she will have to pay again and the Taoiseach is responsible for this. He is responsible for a health service in chaos and there is no point in him saying he is sorry. The fact is he is in charge and the reality is that the Government, led by Fine Gael and supported by the Labour Party-----

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

Will the Deputy put his question?

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-----will not adequately resource our hospitals because they do not believe in a public health model. Is this not why accident and emergency department overcrowding is getting worse?

Is this not why citizens, including Denise, her son Jake and a little baby like Orlaith, are treated like second class citizens in the Taoiseach's two-tier health service?

Comment on this
Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

If the Deputy had said sorry himself a few times in the past, it might have helped matters as well. Of course, Deputy Adams does not use the Irish public health service in the first place. The case that the Deputy mentioned, of the good lady-----

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How does the Taoiseach know that? How does he know it?

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We all know that.

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Cheap shots rather than dealing with the issues.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

The Taoiseach can answer the question himself.

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Does the health service get any funding in America?

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It is $500 a plate for dinner.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The good lady who was admitted to the hospital and was on a trolley in the emergency department was then-----

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This is from a Fine Gael Deputy

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I cannot hear the Taoiseach. He should speak up, please.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

Please stay quiet until we hear the reply.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I do not take directions from Deputy Adams, but if he gets his people to hold their silence, he might hear.

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I cannot hear the Taoiseach.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

Deputy Adams, it was your own Deputy in the back making noise.

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The Taoiseach was mumbling.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Taoiseach is not mumbling at all.

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

Would you please stay quiet? Thank you.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Taoiseach is not mumbling and he does not take directions from the leader of Sinn Féin.

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Will the Taoiseach say that again?

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

If Deputy Adams cannot hear, he should please ask his Deputies behind him to hold their silence.

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Will the Taoiseach do the same?

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The good lady-----

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Will the Taoiseach answer the question?

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Seán Barrett An Ceann Comhairle Fine Gael

Would you please stay quiet?

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The good lady who was admitted to hospital on a trolley in the emergency Department was later removed to a ward and she was on a trolley in that ward. The hospital has waived the charge against that period. I do not know the circumstances of her son, Jake, but there is a very flexible system for application for medical cards where difficulties are encountered by any person-----

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

-----whether they are a child or not. I expect that can be reflected in -----

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A flexible system? It is flexible in refusing.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

-----the system that applies there. If Deputy Adams thinks it is not appropriate to say sorry in these cases, then I disagree with him.

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The Taoiseach has to say more than sorry; he has to fix it.

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Enda Kenny The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Perhaps if he had said it himself a few times in the past it might have helped us.

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