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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Brexit withdrawal agreement

Summary

Deputy Calleary and the Taoiseach discuss reports of a draft Brexit withdrawal treaty, the need to avoid upsetting London’s Cabinet process, publication to the House, legal certainty, and how any treaty changes would be handled through the EU. Party briefings and timing of next steps are also outlined.

Starting yesterday afternoon, we have heard reports of a draft text of a British withdrawal treaty. There have been rumours, counter-rumours, statements of support and the usual statements of defiance even though the document has yet to be published. I gather the document extends to over 400 pages. We appreciate on this side of the House that it is necessary to give the UK Cabinet space this afternoon to consider the document and the findings it contains. Given in particular the Taoiseach's new-found interest in dedramatising the relationship between Ireland and the UK, we understand he is possibly constrained in what he can say. However, he should be very clear that my party considers this document to be as important for the island of Ireland as it is for the United Kingdom and the European Union and expects the Oireachtas to be given the same opportunity as the Parliaments in both of those jurisdictions to discuss and scrutinise the agreement when it is fully available. This document is a seminal one in the history of the island and the Oireachtas should have the power and capacity to scrutinise it on that basis. We need to scrutinise it because it affects not only economic issues but almost every aspect of day-to-day life on this island. It is not only about the backstop for Northern Ireland and the United Kingdom, but about trade, economic, social and civic issues also.

Every Member of the House wants a deal and it is in the interests of the island of Ireland, the United Kingdom and the European Union to get one. Every business owner, farmer and worker looking at us today wants a deal which protects trade and our relationships on an east-west and North-South basis. Nobody wants a border between the North and the South, not even the DUP, and nobody wants a no-deal Brexit scenario. While I appreciate that the Taoiseach cannot speculate on the detail of the draft, I ask him to comment on a number of principles. Can he confirm that the Good Friday Agreement as it stands will not be impacted negatively if the draft withdrawal agreement is ratified? In the case that there is a further extended transition period after the formal withdrawal period concludes, the UK will continue to be a full member of the EU for the next two years. What are the principles which will guide the relationship after that? When will a copy of the draft withdrawal treaty be made available to Members of the House on all sides to allow us to scrutinise it and begin the process of debating an agreement which is so important for Ireland?

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I appreciate forbearance on this issue and the understanding as to why I may not be in a position to answer questions in the detail I might like. I have been in touch with Deputy Calleary's party leader this morning on the issue and around that point. A very important and sensitive Cabinet meeting will take place in London today from 2 p.m. and I do not want to say anything here which might up-end it or make things any more difficult than they already are for the Prime Minister. I know the Deputy will not want to put me in a position where I have to do that.

At the outset, I note once again that Brexit is not our policy. Brexit is not going to be good for Ireland. The best case scenario for Ireland would be for the United Kingdom to remain in the European Union, but that is not a matter for us. It is a matter for the British people and their Parliament and they have made a decision which we must respect. Our objective from day one has been to minimise any harm to Ireland and Northern Ireland and to maximise any opportunities that may arise. Our strategy from day one has been to be European and very much one of the EU 27 and indivisible from them. It has been to ensure that the European Union understood our concerns and vital national interests and to ensure that our concerns and vital national interests became European concerns and interests. Michel Barnier and his team have very much taken that on board as have my colleagues in the European Council, Commission and Parliament. In December last, when the joint report - the agreement between the EU and the UK - was issued, I said the next step was to turn the report into a legally binding and operable withdrawal agreement. While we are close to that point today, it remains a draft agreement. It has yet to be agreed by the UK Government which will discuss it this afternoon. It has yet to be agreed also by the European Council. We may be in a position to have an emergency European Council meeting before the end of the month to do exactly that.

As to the Deputy's questions, my reading is that the Good Friday Agreement is not negatively impacted by this. In fact, it is protected by the draft agreement. Deputy Calleary asked also about the transition period. It is envisaged to run from the end of March next year until the end of 2020 with the possibility of a time-limited extension. During the transition period, the United Kingdom will not be a member state of the European Union. In essence, however, the rules, regulations and acquis would continue to apply to provide businesses and citizens time to prepare for any permanent changes which may take place and, more importantly, to give us time during the transition period to negotiate the future relationship between the EU and the UK around trade and security.

Comment on this

Can the Taoiseach confirm that the agreement will be made available to the House and that there will be a vigorous debate here? We have had 12 months of discussion around last year's agreement and within that discussion there has been tortuous interpretation of language. Language meant something completely different in London to what it was taken to mean in Dublin and vice versa as well as in Brussels. Is the language in this agreement watertight so that it will not be subject to another 12 or 24 months of interpretation and difficult disagreement between our nations? Can the Taoiseach guarantee that the agreement will be time-proof so that no matter who is Taoiseach or Prime Minister, the commitments contained in it will be honoured for however long it lasts? In the event that agreement is not reached, in particular if the draft does not get through the UK Parliament, can the Taoiseach confirm that, in line with the contingency advice of the EU Commission on preparations for a no-deal Brexit, we are in a position to deal with such a scenario?

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

If the agreement is made it will be an international treaty between the European Union, including Ireland, on the one hand and the United Kingdom on the other. As an international treaty, it would, therefore, continue to apply even if there were a change in government here or in the United Kingdom. That is the nature of such agreements.

As to the process and next steps, there are obviously a lot of things that can go wrong. Should the UK Cabinet be in a position this afternoon to express content with the text, it is proposed that the Commission task force might be in a position even tonight to publish the text with the probability of an EU Council meeting on or about 25 November.

As we all know, the text would have to be ratified by Westminster and the European Parliament.

Although it is not legally necessary, my strong view and the decision of the Cabinet is that the text should be put to a vote in Dáil Éireann and I give that commitment now. I appreciate that Members will want to read the text and, therefore, we may need some flexibility around timing. If we are in a position to publish the text and to give Members time to read it, it is intended to offer briefings to all parties this evening. We have arranged for briefings tomorrow morning for the Northern Ireland parties, or at least for those which wish to partake in them. All things going to plan, we may have a debate on the matter next week. This can be agreed by the Business Committee, thus giving everyone the chance to read the agreement in full and to think about it and then having a vote on it in the Dáil.

Comment on this

Yesterday the draft Brexit withdrawal agreement was agreed between the European Union and British negotiators. After all the machinations, false starts and back and forth of the past year and a half, I welcome the fact that we might have a suitable deal on the table. I say "might" because we have not had sight of the text of the deal. However, we are hopeful that a deal which meets what we in Sinn Féin have consistently called for might be on the table and we await the detail of such.

From the beginning of this process, we have consistently called for a special deal for the North of Ireland, reflective of its unique status and the vote that was cast there. The agreement should ensure no hard border on our island, that citizens' rights are protected and that the Good Friday Agreement is protected and upheld. We have put that case at home and abroad. We have urged the Government to promote an all-Ireland view on the matter, which is what has guided our approach in Sinn Féin. We have not sought to play party politics on this issue and I am sure the Taoiseach will acknowledge that, as both he and the Tánaiste have in the past. We have rightly called the Government out when we thought it was on the wrong track but we have been supportive it was when we assessed that it was on the right one.

One of the core issues is that of the Irish backstop which, in our view, remains the bottom line in ensuring that there is never a hard border on the island of Ireland, the interests of citizens are upheld and the Good Friday Agreement is protected. That protection remains absolutely vital and the British Government must be held to the commitment it made last December. Perhaps sense will prevail in Downing Street this afternoon. I hope that will be the case.

The DUP has come out of the traps to oppose what may be on the table. That does not surprise any Members on this side of the House. In opposing any positive solution, it has aligned itself with the most right-wing elements of the Tory Party, UKIP and extremist Brexiteers in moving from an initial position of wanting no hard border on the island of Ireland to apparently actively seeking such a border. It is living in a fantasy land when it comes to Brexit. It has no idea what is on the table but it is certain that it is against it. That is an absolutely reckless and irresponsible position to take.

There is an onus on us all to defend our country's political and economic interests. That should be the position of every person in every part of our Ireland. There is now an onus on the British Government to step up to the mark. Last week, the Taoiseach told the Dáil that the Government will not resile from the fundamental position that a backstop must form part of the withdrawal agreement and that it cannot have an expiry date or unilateral exit clause. Is that still the case?

I ask the Taoiseach to provide detail on when he intends to bring party leaders together in order that they will be as fully briefed as possible on the detail of the deal. It is important that takes place without delay. The Sinn Féin leadership, namely, our party president and vice president, will be speaking to the British Prime Minister, Mrs. Theresa May, after 5 p.m. this evening and it is important that there is a briefing from an Irish perspective before that opportunity arises.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

All things going to plan, we intend to offer a briefing to party leaders and their teams this evening and offer a similar briefing for the SDLP, the Alliance Party and the Green Party in Northern Ireland tomorrow morning.

It is important to remember what the backstop is. It is not our preferred solution but, rather, a fallback or insurance policy. The joint report published in December of last year outlined options A, B and C. Option A involves resolving the issue of the Irish Border in a new future relationship between the EU and the United Kingdom. We will try to negotiate that during the transition period. Option B related to UK-wide specific solutions, but in many ways that is now the potential for an extension of the transition period if required. Option C is the backstop which would only kick in if options A and B were unsuccessful. The backstop must be in place and legally operable. It cannot have an expiry date and it must not be possible for one side to withdraw from it unilaterally. It is important to appreciate that it is our intention that the backstop should never have to be invoked. If it is invoked, that should be a temporary measure until a new agreement is put in place to supersede all or part of it. However, it must apply until that is the case.

Comment on this

I thank the Taoiseach. He mentioned that in his view the Good Friday Agreement was protected in the draft agreement, which is to be welcomed. We will examine in detail how that stacks up when we receive the published text.

On the guarantee of a permanent backstop, I ask him to outline to the House the nature of any potential revision to the backstop following a review. What would be the role of this Parliament, which the Taoiseach outlined will vote on the agreement, in that regard? Will it be necessary for Ireland to consent to any changes to the backstop?

I welcome that briefings of party leaders will take place, but it is important that they take place in a timely manner. Given our role and the opportunities we have had to deal with the British Prime Minister and negotiators at a European level in advocating the Irish position, it is important that a briefing from an Irish perspective takes place before the Sinn Féin leadership speaks to the British Prime Minister, Mrs. Theresa May, after 5 p.m. today. That should be taken into account in scheduling the briefings.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

It is important to point out that if it is concluded, the agreement will be between the EU and the UK. Ireland is part of the EU but will not separately sign up to the agreement. However, any change to the agreement will be made through the European Council of which, of course, Ireland is a member, in the form of the Taoiseach.

I accept the Deputy's points regarding things being done in a timely manner and note his comments on the phone call to the Prime Minister, Mrs. May. Members should bear in mind that Cabinet meeting will begin at 2 p.m. and may not be finished by 5 p.m. We will have to see how this plays out over the course of the day. We want to be able to give Members the text as well as a briefing on the text. However, I remember the furore when the German Parliament saw elements of our budget before our Parliament did. That must work both ways. We have had enormous support and solidarity from other EU member states and institutions throughout this process and I do not want to put documents which members of other parliaments have not seen into the public domain. It is very important that this is all done at the same time and done by Brussels.

I wish to put on the record of the House that this is a difficult time for the unionist community in Northern Ireland. Many unionists may be feeling vulnerable, isolated or quite worried about what may be agreed in the coming days. I wish to say to them that the Good Friday Agreement will be protected.

That includes a recognition of the fact that we respect the territorial integrity of the United Kingdom and the principle of consent, which is that there can be no change to the constitutional status of Northern Ireland unless a majority of people there say so. We are very happy to have that written into any agreement because it gives the unionist community a legal guarantee.

Comment on this