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Dáil
‹ An tOrd Gnó - Order of Business

National broadband scheme details

Summary

After the suspension, Brian Stanley and Pearse Doherty pressed Bruton on the broadband scheme’s cost to householders, the State’s exposure, and whether the contract tied the State’s hands. Bruton said most customers would not pay more, that wireless flexibility existed for a small percentage, and that if the project failed the State would retain the rolled-out lines.

Pat the Cope Gallagher An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

Before the House suspended, the Ceann Comhairle took a number of names and the first on the list is Deputy Stanley.

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I wish to ask the Minister, Deputy Bruton, a question concerning a commitment in the programme for Government regarding the national broadband scheme. During a briefing with senior officials in the Department this morning on the scheme and the announcement yesterday, a number of questions came up and some answers were given. One answer related to the cost per household of the roll-out of the scheme. A question was raised in the context of where it exceeds a certain amount that the householder will have to pay. Along with the taxpayer paying a subsidy, householders in remote rural areas will also have to pay perhaps up to several thousand euros. Will the Minister confirm that?

Will he confirm also with respect to all the subsidy that will be going to other companies for renting the infrastructure in terms of poles etc. that almost €1 billion will go to Eir? Another area of concern relates to the board. The Minister, or his successor, will have the right to appoint one member to the board of an entity called National Broadband Ireland, NBI. Does that mean the other eight members will be appointed by Granahan McCourt? He might confirm that. These are key issues for the House and for the taxpayers who are investing almost €3 billion in this project.

Given what has emerged in the documentation regarding the fact that there is only one bidder-----

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Pat the Cope Gallagher An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

The time is limited.

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-----is the Minister concerned that both hands of the State are being tied behind its back with this project?

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Pat the Cope Gallagher An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

Deputy Doherty has a related question.

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The documents that have been released today are staggering in terms of their critique and the mess that has been created. There is a reference over and over again in separate documents to the risk of the contractor abandoning the project. The risk of it abandoning and not honouring the contract during its duration is referenced in one document and another one states that the result could be that we would be stranded with an obsolete asset and that, despite paying €2.275 billion, it is an asset we would not own. Another document references a risk that the operator could abandon the project. This has been identified as a risk because of the lack of skin in the game on the part of the operator. If the operator abandons the project and, therefore, no broadband is rolled out to rural Ireland, what is plan B? The Department outlined the various capital projects that could be abandoned to accommodate the €1 billion additional capital investment that will be required. Will the Minister confirm that no projects will be delayed or abandoned? Will he confirm also that when the Taoiseach mentioned a €4 billion to €5 billion figure for metro north in the press conference yesterday, it was a slip of the tongue and that we will not see another project go from €3 billion to €5 billion overnight?

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Pat the Cope Gallagher An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

A number of Members are listed and we are a little behind in the time. I ask the Minister to give a brief answer.

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It is not anticipated that people will have to pay more. There is flexibility in the contract that up to 2% can be provided not by fibre to the home but by wireless. There is within the contract a provision, the same as would apply in a telecommunications standard line, that if the connection is more than a certain figure, a cost could fall on the individual premises, but it is not anticipated that will come into operation because it is believed that the flexibility of providing a wireless solution will avoid that happening.

The question of the charge that has to be paid for renting poles or ducts, which could be rented from Eir, the ESB or any other provider, is regulated and that price is set by ComReg. It is subject to whatever ComReg determines it is. The vast majority of poles will be rented, so there will be a charge, as Deputy Doherty said, of €1 billion.

There will be a ministerial representative but by far the more intrusive governance into this company will be through the contract we have negotiated. That will provide very detailed reporting of the progress of this contract roll-out to our Department where we will have financial, legal and technical experts overseeing the detailed roll-out because of the fact there is a contingency amount which could only come to be paid in the event that the Department is satisfied there is audited grounds for making those payments. There is very detailed supervision.

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The Minister has not-----

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Pat the Cope Gallagher An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

The Deputy cannot come back in. The Minister responded.

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If that number of questions were permitted, I have to take the time to answer them or I am not doing my job.

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Pat the Cope Gallagher An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Fianna Fáil

I ask the Minister to be mindful of other colleagues.

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They have been permitted to be asked so I am trying to answer them. If the company cannot complete this - the asset - we will only have paid for whatever has been rolled out at that point. Those lines that have been rolled out at that point will revert to the State. We will have possession of the lines that have been rolled out. I can assure Deputy Doherty that no capital project will be displaced by this. The Minister has indicated that very clearly and that was clear in the statement issued yesterday.

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