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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Covid crisis and school safety

Summary

Paul Murphy argued the Government was sleepwalking into another lockdown, challenged its handling of Covid in schools, and asked the Taoiseach to back air-quality legislation. The Taoiseach repeatedly defended public health advice, said schools are safe, cited CO2 monitors and paediatric pressures such as RSV, but the exchange became highly repetitive and the Deputy insisted his questions were unanswered.

We are again in a crisis as regards Covid. The Government needs to acknowledge that. Our ICU capacity is in danger of being overrun. There is also the threat of Covid spreading into nursing homes yet again. The Government is once again sleepwalking us into lockdown at Christmas. It is Groundhog Day. What is most surprising is the Government is reported to have been taken aback at the level of Covid-related hospitalisations and the situation we are now in.

Why on earth is the Taoiseach surprised? Look at the decisions his Government made that brought us to this point. After more than a year and a half of a pandemic, it has failed to increase our ICU capacity to the levels that are necessary. We are sitting at little more than half the average for the OECD and, at the rate the Government is going, it will take 13 years to reach the OECD average. After the first Covid wave passed, the private hospital capacity was returned to the for-profit sector, and now it is to be presumed the State will pay over the odds to lease them again instead of taking them permanently into the public system and using them to build a properly funded, quality, one-tier national health service.

Covid-19 is an airborne virus but the Government has repeatedly downplayed the crucial role played by poor ventilation in spreading it. We are 21 months into an airborne pandemic and there are still no legally enforceable, measurable standards for indoor air quality. It is quite incredible when you think about it. The Government refused to introduce anything other than guidance to ensure schools, workplaces and public transport are well ventilated or, where necessary, have HEPA filters, then forced people back into poorly ventilated workplaces and classrooms and onto crowded public transport. Incredibly, after refusing to supply a single HEPA filter to our schools, the Government then abandoned contact tracing and testing in our schools entirely. And so here we are again, utterly predictable and utterly disastrous. To avoid lockdowns it is not enough to rely on the vaccines, crucial though they are. We need a vaccines-plus strategy, based on the principles of prevent, vaccinate and control. We need ventilation, vaccination and vastly increased levels of testing.

At this late stage, will the Government finally take action to avoid the current crisis becoming a calamity? Will it commit to providing antigen tests for free to those who want them, as is done with the National Health Service, NHS, in Britain, to encourage widespread and regular use through the population, and expand PCR testing capacity, which is overwhelmed? Will the Government deal with the crucial issue of ventilation and follow the example of Belgium by saying every workplace needs a CO2 monitor and that CO2 must be kept at safe levels? Finally, will it make our schools as safe as possible for pupils and teachers? Will it reintroduce contact tracing and testing immediately and follow the example of Germany by introducing HEPA filters in all our classrooms?

Comment on this

Our public health advice has been consistent from the get-go that our schools are safe places in respect of the management of Covid-19. A total of 35,000 CO2 monitors have been issued to our schools and they are in use. As I have said, the advice is that if children are symptomatic, in terms of colds or whatever, they should not be sent to school. The biggest issue facing children is RSV, a non-Covid respiratory illness. Those are the facts right now in respect of the challenges that face our healthcare system in regard to paediatrics. It is serious where we are. Given the brief nature of this interchange, I will expand later on the situation that faces us.

The Deputy opposes the extension of the legislation that will enable us to continue with our management of Covid-19. I see an entire inconsistency in his approach, particularly given he was the strongest advocate in the House for zero Covid from the outset and he wanted a zero Covid regime for a long time. He went silent on that when it suited him.

We are doing 200,000 PCR tests a week. We have one of the better PCR systems in Europe and globally in terms of the volume per capita and the level of testing we are doing. We have also expanded antigen testing in different locations. Substantial work is required on the communications of antigen testing. The public health advice, as we know, from the outset has not been enthusiastic about antigen testing. We formed an expert advisory group, which has recommended a series of steps to be taken in respect of antigen testing, but the public health advice is still cautious in respect of it. I support the further roll-out of antigen testing, but I accept a strong communications programme is required on how, when and why the use of antigen testing is important.

The use of antigen testing has been expanded in respect of close contacts and so forth. Tests are being issued and more initiatives will be taken regarding antigen testing, which the Minister will deal with shortly.

In that context, I do not accept the Deputy's criticisms as being valid on testing. In fact, we have a very robust testing system. The issue is that when we open society, socialisation increases and that creates opportunities for a variant as transmissible as Delta. We had, however, to give working people, and people generally, the opportunity to go back to work. By reopening the economy, we have created thousands of jobs. The situation now, however, as we move into the winter and with the seasonality that applies to this virus, is one where we need to take this pending threat very seriously. Collectively, as a society, we need to reduce socialisation and the Government has announced, and will be announcing, steps in respect of specific measures to add to the overall objective of reducing socialisation and contacts and rolling out the booster programme, along with other initiatives.

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We are way over time. I call Deputy Paul Murphy.

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Someone said to me earlier that Leaders' Questions should be renamed Leaders' obfuscations. I asked three simple questions. I did not get an answer to a single one of them. Instead, I got a repetition of what is just a line that schools are safe places. Is the Taoiseach seriously saying that no transmission of Covid-19 takes place in schools? Is that why he is saying that schools are safe places? That is not what the international evidence suggests. There are children in our hospitals now with Covid-19. That is what the figures demonstrate.

The Taoiseach suggested that it is some kind of revelation that when we reopen that there will be increased socialisation and that then, of course, we will have an increased spread of the virus. Absolutely, but why did the Government then not do what was necessary to make schools, workplaces and public transport safe? That is what my questions relate to. Will the Government introduce free antigen testing? Will the Government introduce HEPA filters into our schools? Will the Government also finally recognise the role that the airborne transmission of Covid-19 plays and introduce legislation to require clean air for everybody?

It is not even necessary for the Government to write new legislation. We did that in the summertime in the form of the Workplace Ventilation (Covid-19) Bill 2021. The Government will not even have to use its time to do that, because we are going to use our time next week to bring this Bill forward to ensure that everybody in a school or a workplace has a right to clean air and that-----

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I thank the Deputy. His time is up.

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-----if a certain level of carbon dioxide is exceeded, over 900 ppm, then action must be taken. Will the Taoiseach commit to supporting that Bill, even though the Government did not introduce it, to enable people to have safe air and to stop transmission in this way?

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Why does Deputy Paul Murphy ignore public health advice and deny it every time he comes in here talking about schools? I did not repeat a line. I gave a line that we have received in respect of consistent public health advice, but he continually ignores it because it suits his propaganda approach to all of this.

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What does the Taoiseach mean by that?

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The Deputy does not look at this issue from a purely public health perspective. He looks at it from a party or movement advancement perspective. That is my genuine take-away. The Deputy was an advocate for zero Covid for a long time, but now he will not even facilitate the extension of legislation to give capacity for Government to do things, if necessary, in the middle of an emergency. He objects to that and makes a big deal about objecting to that.

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Will the Taoiseach answer my questions, please?

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He does not answer the questions.

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I am answering the Deputy's questions. The Deputy ridicules the idea that public health advice in respect of schools is valid. He has just ridiculed that.

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I ask the Taoiseach to answer the questions, thanks.

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Regarding another of the Deputy's points, he does not seem to accept at all-----

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I ask the Taoiseach to answer the questions, if he does not mind, because there are only 15 seconds left.

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I have been in paediatric hospitals. I was in Clonmel hospital two weeks ago-----

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There were three questions and he has not answered them.

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Deputy Murphy, please. The Taoiseach without interruption.

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Not a single question answered.

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In the paediatric ward in Clonmel hospital, I was told that the issue was RSV in respect of admissions into that ward and the pressure that the ward was under, and other respiratory illnesses. Turning to workplaces, the Deputy knows that we have worked with the trade union movement and the employer organisations-----

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Just the questions, if the Taoiseach would not mind. Please.

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----- in respect of the return-to-work safety protocols.

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Please, I am trying to get answers here.

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Even as we speak, about 50% have returned. Huge efforts have been made in respect of workplaces to make them safe-----

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The Taoiseach said he was going to answer the questions and he has not answered any of them.

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In respect of ventilation in schools, I have said that 35,000 carbon dioxide monitors were distributed to schools up and down the country to monitor air quality and ensure that it was okay.

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Please, we are way over time.

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Not a single question answered. The Taoiseach said that he was answering the questions and he did not answer a single question.

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I call Deputy Berry.

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