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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Mica and pyrite redress scheme

Summary

Deputy Doherty pressed the Taoiseach on the revised mica and pyrite redress scheme, arguing the details still leave Donegal families facing unaffordable costs. The Taoiseach said the scandal arose from defective blocks and failures to follow regulations, defended the State's substantial contribution, and rejected claims that homeowners would have to find the upfront money or that the Government caused the problem.

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Leas-Cheann Comhairle. Ar dtús báire ba mhaith liom tréaslú leo uilig atá ag troid ar son an chirt maidir leis an scannal míoca agus pirít, agus an ceart acu agus fios acu caidé mar atá ceart agus cóir. Níl dabht ar bith go raibh fáilte acu roimh cuid de na ceannlínte a bhí á bhfógairt maidin inniu, is é sin 100% tacaíochta, ach nuair a amharcann siad ar na sonraí ansin tá imní ar go leor teaghlach i nDún na nGall agus níos faide. Ba mhaith liom go bhfreagródh an Taoiseach cúpla ceist fá dtaobh de sin.

I commend all those who are fighting for justice for those who have been impacted by the mica and pyrite scandal, particularly those from my county of Donegal. Right up and down the west coast of Ireland, they opened up their hearts and opened up their homes and told us their personal stories. They told us about the impact their crumbling homes have had on them, their families and their mental health. They have fought for justice and fought for what is right. From the schoolkids who came to protest outside the gates of Leinster House to all those around the world who supported this campaign, these campaigners won the hearts and minds of the Irish nation. They have moved the Government into a position where I believe it never wanted to be and a long way from where it was.

This scandal has devastated the lives of ordinary families and is a direct consequence of the Celtic tiger era, an era of no regulation and light-touch regulation. These families have worked hard all their lives and have scrimped and saved to build homes for themselves and their families. They want what every single person would want, and that is a place that is safe and secure and a place where they can raise their families. Through no fault of their own, however, they find themselves in a nightmare situation where their houses are literally crumbling around them. They have fought hard and fought a good campaign and they deserve our praise today.

We have been here before, however, and the devil is always in the detail and in the implementation of these schemes. These families previously signed up to a scheme only to find out that it did not do what it said it would do. This time it needs to be different. In Sinn Féin's view - and we have raised this with the Taoiseach - the Housing Agency, just like it did in the north Leinster pyrite scheme, should be tasked with delivering the scheme and families should not be left to fend for themselves. However, we are already hearing contradictory reports about what is on the table. We are informed that the campaigners were told this morning, before the Cabinet meeting, that what would be on the table as redress would be €145 per square foot. We are now informed that that is only available for the first 1,000 sq. ft and on a sliding scale thereafter. I wish to press the Taoiseach on why the Cabinet made such a decision. Did it run the numbers and look at how they would affect families in Donegal and elsewhere? Is the Taoiseach aware that, in respect of the scheme that currently operates, the average cost for demolition and rebuild of a home that has been notified to Donegal County Council is €150 per square foot?

The average size of a mica-affected house in County Donegal is 2,300 sq. ft. According to the Government's sliding scale, a homeowner will have to find €45,500 to rebuild their house. In the case of the average one-off house, which comes in at just shy of 2,600 sq. ft in this State, according to the sliding scale that the Cabinet has signed off on, the homeowner will have to find €56,000. The families are asking how this could be, and where they will find the money. They thought they would get 100% redress. They thought the Government had heard them. Can the Taoiseach confirm to the Dáil and, more importantly, reassure those families that the numbers I have referenced are not those that will be applicable? If the Government runs a scheme that provides €145 for the first 1,000 sq. ft and €110 for the rest, families will have to make such a contribution.

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First, I say to the Deputy that every party and every Dáil Deputy in this House is extremely well aware of and very concerned about the devastation wreaked on many families as a result of the mica scandal. The scandal is not about the absence of regulation; it is about a failure by certain operations to adhere to the regulations. We must call that out. Those responsible need to be held accountable for what transpired. That is the first point I make.

Families need their houses rebuilt. To be fair to the Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, he has focused on this issue for quite some time and has worked with the working group. I went up last summer to meet with the working group. I heard their main concerns about the original scheme, which was meant in good faith. The scheme was accepted and endorsed by the Deputy's party at the time. Indeed, so satisfied was his party with the last scheme that it did not even reference it in its general election manifesto. Those are the facts. We also asked the Deputy's party leader, who cannot be here today as she is on her way to the United States, to submit the party's proposals and specific ideas around how this scheme could operate, but it decided not to send any suggestion to the working group or to the Minister.

The new scheme will improve the 90% maximum grant to a 100% grant for all remediation options 1 to 5. The maximum expenditure cap for option 1, demolition and rebuild, will be increased from €275,000, under the original scheme that the Deputy's party endorsed, to €420,000. It is estimated that the new scheme will cost over €2.2 billion. There will be a central role for the Housing Agency. There is a clearer damage calculation and the introduction of an independent appeals process. Social housing and homes will be remediated at a cost of around €180 million. There are 900 rented properties that are registered with the Residential Tenancies Board, RTB. They will also be eligible for the scheme, with one application per household permitted, to the cost to €160 million. A fixed sum of €20,000 will be allocated to each homeowner to rent alternative accommodation should they have to leave their house for reconstruction, and they will be allocated storage costs of up to €5,000. Under the scheme, €145 will be provided per square foot for the first 1,000 sq. ft.

The Society of Chartered Surveyors Ireland, SCSI, has developed the methodology that will be used. It comes up with an annual average. Currently, the average rebuild cost is €138 per square foot. We are going with €145 for the first 1,000 sq. ft. That will change again in April with the publication of the new surveyors' guide. We will be guided by the SCSI and its methodology, which uses a sliding scale. If you talk to any quantity surveyor, that is perfectly understandable. There are economies of scale at play in the context of larger houses. We are absolutely adamant that the scheme should not disadvantage smaller houses, which represent the bulk of houses covered by this scheme, by the introduction of a flat rate, for example. The sliding scale is an appropriate way to do it. We need to depoliticise the methodology around the pricing and the square footage. We believe we can do that by that working with the SCSI on an annual basis. The scheme will also take into account inflation over the years. We have also built in certification and a State guarantee for remedial works, so that an applicant who chooses from options 2 to 5, does not demolish the property and does other repairs and so on will not be penalised if subsequently something untoward happens again. Such a person will have the option to apply for a second grant.

Without doubt, the Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage has worked extremely hard with all of the parties to find a very comprehensive solution to this issue and to put in place the correct governance around the scheme to ensure we can deal with a very pressing and unacceptable situation for too many families in County Donegal and in other counties.

We are determined to get started on this now and to get the job done.

Comment on this

The devil is always in the detail. These families are going through an absolutely terrible situation. You can never realise it until you are invited into their homes, where they tell you their own story and let you into their own personal scenario. We need to ensure this scheme is fit for purpose. I have asked the Taoiseach a simple question. I have the SCSI calculator and I have just entered into it a 2,300 sq. ft home in the north west. The calculator says that it would cost €334,000 to build. These are the same numbers I gave out earlier. The problem with the Government scheme is that it drops to €110 per square foot after 1,000 sq. ft and the family will have to find €45,000. That is a big problem. These families do not have €45,000. If a family has the average one-off house, they will have to find €56,000. The SCSI calculation currently for the north west is based on a rate of €145 per sq. ft, and it does not have a drop down to €110, on which the Cabinet signed off. I ask the Taoiseach to explain this and, more importantly, to say to the families that he is wrong, and that they will not have to put their hands in their pockets for that amount to have their homes rebuilt due to something that was not their fault in the first place.

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No Opposition party replied to a written request two months ago, after the working group report was published, to detail their specific position on how the scheme should be improved. You need to answer that fundamental question. You could have got involved. You could have come up with your proposals and your plan, but you had no plan and you had no proposal.

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Answer the question.

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The reason you did not is that you simply want to exploit this, unfortunately, for electoral and political gain. We want to provide a solution.

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It is you who is playing politics.

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What is the answer?

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The bottom line is that the Deputy behind Deputy Doherty endorsed the original scheme back in January 2020, a scheme we accept was not suitable. We are saying we must depoliticise the methodology around the costings here. The SCSI on an annual basis updates the square footage building costs. They accept a sliding scale. Most people involved in building and surveying accept the methodology of a sliding scale. We did not want to disadvantage the smaller houses. If you look at the property tax returns, for example, you will see that the vast majority of housing in Donegal is around the €200,000-plus mark. I accept that rebuilding costs can be more expensive than current valuations in terms of the cost of construction and so on, but it is a much more advanced scheme than the previous scheme with regard to the €20,000 grants-----

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They still have to find the €50,000-----

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-----and the upfront costs being dealt with. They will not have to find that money.

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Catherine Connolly An Leas-Cheann Comhairle Independent

We are moving on.

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