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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí (Atógáil) - Leaders' Questions (Resumed)

Housing and rental policy

Summary

The Taoiseach set out Government plans to increase social housing, ramp up cost rental, buy homes where tenants face notices to quit, and bring forward a budget package to support both renters and landlords. Opposition leaders challenged the claims, accused the Government of driving homelessness, and argued the housing crisis is the Government’s responsibility.

Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I want to be associated with your remarks, a Cheann Comhairle, and to welcome the ambassador to the Chamber. It is really good to have the British Ambassador present. I look forward to building relations between Ireland and the United Kingdom in the period ahead, in particular as the Windsor Framework is implemented.

On this matter, what Deputy McDonald is trying to do here is to create a false narrative, a false choice, and, as is often the case, a divisive one. It is not about renters versus landlords or balancing the rights of one against the rights of others. Renters need landlords and landlords need renters. One of the many problems we have in Ireland with our housing system is that we do not have enough landlords. Given our growing population, we probably need tens of thousands more properties available for people to rent. What happens when landlords leave the market? Rents go up, fewer properties are available and renters lose out, especially those who need to move, those who are young and are renting for the first time, people who are coming to Ireland to work who need somewhere to rent and also people coming back to Ireland from abroad - returning emigrants, of which there are tens of thousands every year. What we have seen in recent years is more than 40,000 small landlords leave the market and very few have entered. There will always be landlords leaving the market and there will always be a certain number entering, but we need now to stem the flow of small landlords in particular leaving the market and to increase the flow of new landlords coming in. We will not be able to turn this around unless we do that. That is why we see long queues of people any time a property is available for rent, who are hoping to view it and that it can be the place they can call home. That is why a property advertised on a website is taken down almost an hour or two later. That is also why we see rents for new tenancies being so high, relative to existing tenancies. It is because there are not enough landlords.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

There are not enough properties available. What we need to do is stem the tide of small landlords leaving the market and increase the number of new landlords coming into the market. That is what the Government wants to do. We are going to do four things to make the situation better.

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Does the Taoiseach believe what he reads out?

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

First, we are going to build more social housing.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Second, we are going to ramp up cost rental.

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Let us have the figures.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Third, we are going to buy properties from landlords where the tenant is a social housing tenant and he or she has been served a notice to quit.

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Seven were purchased in Dublin city.

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The time is up.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Fourth, we are going to develop and build a budget package to help landlords and help renters even more so than has been the case. Let me expand on that a little better. Last year, roughly 8,000 new social homes were built in Ireland. As the Opposition acknowledged yesterday, or at least one person in the Opposition did, that is the highest since 1975, the highest in my lifetime, and we are going to increase it even more this year.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

We are going to try to get towards 12,000 additional social homes. That will make a difference.

The second thing we are going to do is to ramp up cost rental. It is a new form of tenancy and public housing, developed by the previous Government and being implemented by this one. That will help people who are above the income limits for social housing. We are going to buy up more rental properties where the tenant is a housing assistance payment, HAP, or rental accommodation scheme, RAS, tenant. That means if the landlord is selling up, we are empowering and funding local authorities, all of which are not controlled by Government parties by the way, to purchase those properties, and they should.

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Go on out of that. That is a stupid comment.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

We are also developing a further budget package to help tenants and to help landlords. It is not about one versus the other. As I stated, the Deputy is trying to create a divisive and false narrative that it is landlords versus renters and renters versus landlords.

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Jesus, Mary and Joseph.

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The Taoiseach could answer the question.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I have answered the Deputy's question.

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People are homeless and the Taoiseach is talking about the budget.

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Members should be quiet please.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I have answered the Deputy's question.

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Members should please be quiet.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Sinn Féin is back to its old ways again. When we ask them about their finances, we get a deafening silence.

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We are out of time.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

They run and hide.

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There are homeless children.

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The Taoiseach is losing the argument.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

When I try to answer their questions, which I did try to do, they try to shout me down. What sort of party is that?

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There is no one shouting you down, Leo. Relax.

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Could we listen to each other, respectfully?

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Members can disagree all they like. Deputy McDonald has the floor.

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Thank you, a Cheann Comhairle. That is excellent. That was very well said. The only false narrative being spun here is that the housing emergency is the fault of landlords. Let me scotch that. It is not. Responsibility for this emergency lies fairly and squarely at the feet of the Taoiseach and his Government.

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Deputies

Hear, hear.

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That is the narrative. The choice here is between having a roof over your head or not; having rent that you can afford or not; having a Government that will stand up and defend renters or not; having a Government with the basic intelligence and cop-on to know that one does not create more uncertainty for renters at a time when supply is that tight and rents are so high and people are to the pin of their collar.

People are afraid now. There are working families who are afraid of what lies ahead. I asked the Taoiseach to state very clearly what a family should do, in the coming weeks and months, when they get a notice to quit and when they are evicted. Where does that working family go? I would like the Taoiseach to answer that question.

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Deputies

Hear, hear.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I answered the Deputy's question. Perhaps she could not hear the answer because she was too busy shouting me down, or the people behind her were too busy shouting me down. The options include social housing. We are going to build more social housing than ever before. We are ramping up cost rental, which is another option. A third option is we are going to purchase 1,500 homes where the landlord is selling up and there is a social housing tenant in situ. Fourth, we are developing a further budget package to help renters and landlords.

The Deputy stood up there and created a false narrative and another straw man. She said landlords are not to blame for the housing crisis, as if somehow anybody on the Government benches ever made that argument. She is the one who has been consistently demonising small landlords and institutional landlords, not us, so she should not make that false argument. The Deputy kind of makes out that somehow Sinn Féin would be able to solve this crisis. Look to the North. I know she hates it when we talk about the North, but look to the North.

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If you believe that, stand aside, call an election and let us get on with the job.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Let me finish, Deputy. I know you hate the truth. Look to the North, where we have had a Sinn Féin finance minister and a Sinn Féin housing minister.

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We are proud of them.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Do you know how much social housing you built in Northern Ireland last year? Do you know, Deputy?

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There was no Assembly last year.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Under 2,000 in the past year - there was an Assembly - much less per capita than in this State. You say that small landlords are not to blame for the crisis. Fine. What is your proposal? You want to put an extra tax on small landlords.

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We have plenty of proposals.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

To make it even worse-----

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

-----you say you care about first-time buyers. What do you want to do?

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Shame on you, Taoiseach.

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Stop it. This is a serious issue for families who will face eviction.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

You want to take away the help-to-buy scheme. The reason you consistently shout me down when I try to answer your questions is because you cannot handle the answers-----

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You have made a conscious decision to increase homelessness and it is shameful.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

------because you know they are true.

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It is a conscious decision to increase homelessness.

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You have enough money for speculators.

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Please, Deputies.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

On a point of order, I really need to put on the record of the Dáil that what we see here is a party that really just cannot handle honest democratic debate.

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We cannot handle rising homelessness.

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Okay.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

They will not answer questions.

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That is not a point of order.

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On a point of order, this is a Government that cannot deal with the fact that it has made a decision to increase homelessness.

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Deputy Doherty, you are out of order.

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The Government is out of order.

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This is Leader's Questions. Your leader has posed a question. You are not the leader yet. Now-----

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Sorry, a Cheann Comhairle, the Taoiseach made a point of order and questioned the democratic capacities or ability of this party. I might remind the Taoiseach that on the last occasion that we went to the polls, this party and these benches secured more votes than his own.

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Deputies

Hear, hear.

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Thank you, Deputy McDonald.

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We are perfectly entitled to represent the people we represent-----

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That is a political point, not a point of order.

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-----and to do so robustly. That is at the heart of democratic debate.

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Deputies

Hear, hear.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

A Cheann Comhairle-----

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No.

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Please.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

It is a valid point of order, actually.

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Well, if it is a valid point of order, I will hear it.

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So are these the alternatives?

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Deputies, please.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Deputy betrayed the truth once again.

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That is not a point of order.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Her party scored 24.5% of the vote-----

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

-----and they think that gives them right to shout everyone else down.

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That is not a point of order.

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

That is not democratic.

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Are these the alternatives - that outfit or this?

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I call Deputy Bacik.

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Can we show Deputy Bacik the respect that we have not shown the Taoiseach, please?

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Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. It is unedifying to see those two alternatives portrayed. It is good we live in a democracy where there are other choices.

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