I wish to return to the matter of industrial relations difficulties in local government, in particular the difficulty faced by retained firefighters across the country and that faced by water workers who are not intending to transfer to Irish Water. I raised this matter with the Tánaiste, the Minister's party leader, last week. He urged that water workers engage with the industrial relations machinery of the State. However, the difficulty is that they already have engaged with that industrial relations machinery. A framework came out and the Minister welcomed the framework. It was all great. The Minister even wrote a letter to the Irish Congress of Trade Unions saying the framework would be honoured in spirit and in letter.

However, it seems it will not be when it comes to Irish Water workers who wish to remain in the local authorities because they are not being guaranteed their allowances. They cannot get a guarantee around that. They have been in protracted negotiations with the LGMA. While yes, they are free to stay, and yes, there has been progress as the Minister correctly pointed out, on some of the issues, there is no progress on allowances, in particular their weekend allowances. They work over seven days. Most, not all, but most local authority employees work over five days but they work over seven. That allowance is a significant part of their income on a weekly basis and it is also pensionable. It will have large ramifications for workers. Many of them are approaching pensionable age. I dare say many of those will remain in local authorities. With a little bit of ingenuity, many roles in local authorities other than water workers require seven-day cover, for example caretakers. There are many others. If there was any will from the LGMA and from the local authority senior management to accommodate them they could easily be accommodated.

Similarly with firefighters. They voted for industrial action last January. They have been negotiating with the LGMA. There is a huge retention crisis in almost all of the bases in Clare. There are fire services in Ennistimon, Kilrush, Shannon, Killaloe and Scariff. All of them perform a hugely valuable role. They are first responders, not just to fires but to traffic accidents. I should add Ennis also has a retained fire service. Not all the staff in Ennis are retained but the majority are. In Shannon, for example, they provide a back up. That might be anathema or a surprise to the Minister in north County Dublin but in Shannon, retained firefighters provide valuable back-up services to Shannon Airport.

Why would that be anathema to me?

They are understaffed right across to the extent that it is dangerous. They are putting their lives at risk. What is the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, as the line Minister responsible, going to do to avert these impending strikes?

Just to bring the Deputy back, it is important to state that I have great respect for the men and women in the retained fire services. I met many of them throughout the country. That is why I commissioned the report into the retained fire services in Ireland with an emphasis on issues the Deputy mentioned, namely, recruitment and retention. As I said to Deputy Duncan Smith earlier, we had more than 1,000 submissions to that, many of them from firefighters themselves. In December I accepted the recommendation of the management board of the national directorate for fire and emergency management to publish the completed review. I brought it to Cabinet. To be clear, the Government accepted the findings of the report, noting the 13 recommendations contained to address those issues around recruitment and retention in retained fire services and, importantly, to ensure its sustainability into the future particularly around recruitment.

Discussions between staff and employer representatives on the 13 recommendations began and we established the fire services national oversight implementation group to which the Deputy referred and that was chaired by Mr. David Begg in January 2023. The LGMA was involved. It was supported by the Chief Fire Officers Association and officials from my Department. Following a proposal by staff side representatives, discussions on the priority industrial relations, issues of remuneration and work-life balance were moved to third-party facilitation form. That was agreed again by all. Mr. Ultan Courtney was subsequently engaged by the LGMA at the behest of SIPTU to chair those discussions. Broadly, they went very well. The agreed key deliverable required that the process is a revised composite agreement that would be agreed by all stakeholders. That will standardise future employment terms and conditions across all local authorities, including pay and allowances. During those discussions, real progress was made on the provision of a revised model of retained fire services delivery that would provide for effective service delivery and a suitable work-life balance as I mentioned earlier, including structured time off, which is a major issue for people who work in the retained fire services. However at this stage it has not been possible to reach a positive conclusion of that process to the satisfaction of all of the parties. I have outlined to Deputy Duncan Smith a flavour of the things that were offered. SIPTU notified all local authorities of the intention of the retained fire services to begin a period of industrial action from 6 June with weekly escalations following that. It will not affect emergency service provision. A small number of issues are outstanding, mainly related to a pay element that can be resolved. However, we also have the public sector pay talks - Deputy McNamara will be coming back in in a second - in relation to Building Momentum. Therefore we cannot do it necessarily outside of that. We made real progress on the rostering, on time off and on allowances also. I want this to be resolved. I have retained the fire services directly under myself. I have not delegated that function because I have immense regard for it. We can resolve it. There is a desire to do so.

Is the Minister saying that the retainer paid to retained firefighters is going to be linked to the pay of other public service employees as part of the public service agreement, guaranteeing them a real, proper wage? That is something they would welcome but I do not believe that is what the Minister is saying. I would very much like to see that happening because of the service that they provide. Of course many of them are already on social welfare so it is already costing the State because due to the onerous requirements around being a retained fire officer, it is very hard to get employment. If an employer is willing to facilitate them, they have to be within a certain distance from the station.

In regard to the other successful negotiations that the Minister pointed to and how well they were going, but for the fact that there is going to be a strike next week, does the LGMA enjoy some kind of a veto over the Department? The Government signed off on something and agreed with something and then it passed it back to negotiations and the LGMA vetoed it. The Minister wrote in a letter to Congress that their pay would be honoured in spirit and in letter. Will they get their weekend allowance? Is the LGMA going to be allowed to be allowed to veto it, as the LGMA is allowed to veto progress with regard to the retained fire officers?

No party has a veto. I am not going to negotiate here in the Dáil. I have outlined very significant progress that we have made. There is a desire among all parties to get this resolved. It has been a difficult process right the way through. The first thing I did when appointed Minister was to remove any reference to the fact that there would be any compulsory transfer. There will be no compulsory transfers. Anyone who wants to stay in local government will stay in local government and his or her pay and conditions will be protected. I put that in writing, myself. That is absolute fact. There are issues around overtime and allowances, which I believe are eminently resolvable. We have already said with regard to allowances that for someone who stays in the local government sector that the equivalent overtime will be offered in that space. I have today written to the unions. I have asked them to re-engage under the Irish Water consultative group. I do not believe there is a need for industrial action. I do not believe there is a need for the public to be discommoded in any way over a very small number of issues.

I thank the Minister.

I am asking people and unions to re-engage with a process that has worked very well. We are close to its finalisation. Sometimes things can get tricky towards the end. That can happen just before an agreement but I believe that an agreement can be made and I am open for that to happen.

It is 25% of their pay. That is not a small issue.

That concludes Leaders' Questions.