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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Tusla and child custody cases

Summary

Deputy McGrath praises Jonathan Irwin, then raises allegations of false Tusla claims and argues public bodies should be held accountable. The Taoiseach defends Tusla staff, says custody decisions are for the courts, and insists they act on evidence; McGrath objects that such cases are handled behind closed doors, while Deputy Coveney says they should be because children are vulnerable.

At the outset, I wish to express my sympathy on the passing of the businessman and child campaigner Jonathan Irwin. I extend my sympathies to his wife, former Senator Mary Ann O'Brien, his family and all the staff, nurses and children who avail of supports from the Jack and Jill Foundation. He was a wonderful man who did so much for many sick children.

Yesterday morning, William Porter from County Donegal gave a harrowing account on Highland Radio of the false allegations made against him by Tusla social workers, and the devastating impact it had on his family and children. Tusla social workers falsely accused him of child abuse of his own children. Tusla has now given him an official apology, and of course after a High Court case the State must pay compensation. Deputy Pearse Doherty raised this here last week with the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman.

I have spoken to William Porter. What is deeply troubling about this case is that it appears there has been State collusion by Tusla and An Garda Síochána in the Republic, and PSNI child protection services in Northern Ireland, to frame an innocent man for a crime he did not commit, and to deny him access to his daughter for several years. This is shocking. I can remember the Dowra case with the former Minister, Seán Doherty, and the furore, and there was no child abuse in it. However, this is outrageous.

The scandal is just the latest in a long list of scandals involving Tusla that are drip-fed to us every week, and which are wreaking devastating consequences on families and children. A study by the UCD school of social policy, social work and social justice, published in June, revealed that teenage girls taken into care by Tusla and accommodated in private residential care were being trafficked for sexual exploitation by gangs of predatory men. That was last June. In September, the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, confirmed that his Department deleted, if you would not mind, three of the four reports pertaining to children taken into care by Tusla, which were given to him by retired Judge Dermot Simms.

The common thread running through all of these cases is that there appears to be absolutely no accountability or respect for families or anybody else on the part of Tusla. It is a public body funded by the State. It is truly shocking. We had the spectacle announced last Tuesday that the regulatory body CORU is going to conduct an inquiry, in private, into the conduct of two or three of the social workers involved in the Maurice McCabe case ten years ago. Deich mbliana ó shin, and it is still not investigated. Now it is going to be an inside job. This just beggars belief.

Will the Taoiseach accept that Tusla, which will be a decade old next January, is unfit for purpose, is out of control, has no accountability and listens to nobody? Will he hold a public inquiry into it? It is badly needed. It must be remembered that Tusla is a public body, as I said, paid for by the taxpayer. It has a fundamental duty of self-scrutiny in the pursuit of high standards. As if all the allegations made by Tusla social workers were not bad enough, the agency is unable to determine the whereabouts of 52 children who were taken into care and are missing under the watch of Tusla. We need a public inquiry here.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Tusla has an extraordinarily difficult job. The people who work in Tusla are very committed and do work which I think very few of us in this House would be willing to do. They look after children who have been abandoned and abused by their parents, have come to this country unaccompanied and have endured horrific neglect and abuse. It is totally wrong-headed to in any way try to blame the staff in Tusla or the agency for that. They are the ones trying to help the children who have suffered and experienced these things. They are not the cause of the problem, they are the ones trying to help to put things right. We should not lose sight of that. It is a very difficult job for which the outcomes can never be as good as we would like. It is an accountable body established under law. It used to be part of the HSE but is no longer - it is a dedicated agency in its own right. It has a board and is accountable to the Minister for children, and also to the Oireachtas through the joint committee. I know it regularly comes in for hearings and to answer questions. The Deputy mentioned that social workers are accountable to CORU, the regulatory body for that agency.

The Deputy mentioned Jonathan Irwin at the outset of his remarks. I join the Deputy in recognising his life and contribution and extend my condolences to his wife, friends and family. He was a fine man. I did not always agree with him but I know he always had the best intentions. One area he worked on closely when I was Minister for Health was reforming the rules around medical cards for children with profound disabilities. At the time, it was means tested. We changed the rules so that any child with a terminal illness who was end-of-life, and any child with a severe disability who was in receipt of a domiciliary care allowance payment, automatically got a medical card regardless of their parents' means and incomes. That was a significant change made at that time. He contributed to that change in policy. I want to recognise that in the House today.

Comment on this

I thank the Taoiseach for that. We accept that a lot of good work is done by Tusla, as mentioned in the Taoiseach's reply, but we cannot allow public bodies like this to go off and carry on all of these improprieties. Ten years on, we are investigating what was done to Maurice McCabe. It is no wonder they do it and get away with it if they are going to get a flag of honour from this House. It is unacceptable. Deputy Durkan has spoken in this House several times about the situation in which a mother reports sexual abuse to the Garda, Tusla gets involved, experts are appointed, the family court accuses the mother of parental alienation and recommends that custody be given to the perpetrator. This is shocking stuff. I have met these mothers and families from the midlands, County Tipperary and all over the country. We cannot just stand up and say everything is fine and Tusla does great work. It does but it has gone astray. It was a part of the HSE that was hived off with no proper functions or diktats. We need a public inquiry. The Taoiseach standing up defending Tusla's work and praising it is not acceptable. Lives have been destroyed; 52 children in its care are missing. We all have children and grandchildren and want the best for them. It is shocking to stand up, dismiss that and say Tusla does everything right, even though it is responsible and is not accountable to anybody.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Decisions regarding custody are made by the courts. Our courts act independently of Tusla and of the Government. The court hears both sides of the argument, hears the case and looks at the evidence, and-----

Comment on this

Behind closed doors.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

-----then it makes a decision. It is not the case that judges always make the right decisions.

Comment on this

It is behind closed doors.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

Nobody always makes the right decisions but they do it on the basis of the evidence and arguments they hear.

Comment on this

It is not a public court.

Comment on this

It should not be. They are vulnerable children.

Comment on this