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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

St John of God services in Kerry

Summary

Michael Healy-Rae raised serious concerns about the dispute between the HSE and St. John of God Community Services in Kerry, warning that service users and families were being caught in the middle. The Taoiseach said he was working with ministers to secure a resolution, noting a proposal with extra funding and a path to address legacy deficits.

The matter I will raise is a matter of great concern to the Taoiseach, his Minister for Health and all his Government. Currently, St. John of God in Kerry supports adults and children with intellectual disabilities. The breakdown in Kerry is as follows: 230 adults with intellectual disabilities attend residential and day care services throughout County Kerry. They attend 16 day services with facilities in their own communities in towns such as Castleisland, Killorglin, Kenmare, Dingle, Listowel and Tralee. People also travel to attend a day service on the grounds of St. Mary of the Angels. There are also nine group home facilities across Tralee and Killorglin, a further ten apartments where people are supported to live in Tralee and an excellent St. Mary of the Angels facility in Beaufort, where 58 residents live. On services for intellectual disability, five adults attend a respite service in Listowel, 50 children attend respite in Listowel and Beaufort and there is an after-school service in Cahersiveen. In excess of 400 hardworking staff work in various facilities across County Kerry, supporting men, women and children and their families. This is a public service and it is incumbent on the Government to maintain it.

Given that St. John of God Community Services has served notice to transfer, what guarantee can be given to the service users, their families and the staff in those services that their services will be maintained in the current facilities and that staff employment will be secure into the future? This is important because these are the most vulnerable people in our society. These are the people we cherish and we want them to be minded and cared for. No one can say they were surprised, but since this announcement was made by St. John of God, I heard Ministers saying they were shocked. I would love to know what shocked them. We all knew that there was an ongoing dispute about budgeting and that the ongoing negotiations had broken down so I cannot understand how any Minister would be surprised by the announcement by St. John of God.

I do not want to get into an argument over St. John of God or the HSE funding. I do not want to blame the Government or anything like that. I want to hear a caring Taoiseach and a caring Government say that they are concerned about this announcement and that their priority is the service users and their moms, dads, siblings and grandparents, just as they are the priority of everyone in this House. The budget will have to be sorted out, of course, but our main aim is to protect these vulnerable people who have physical or intellectual disabilities. They are our priority.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I thank the Deputy for raising the important issue of the St. John of God Community Services and for contacting me about it during the week, as other Deputies did. Everyone here is aware there is a dispute between the HSE on one side and the board of St. John of God on the other. Both sides are putting their best foot forward and negotiating hard so that we can come to a resolution. What happens in that scenario is that service users and their families get caught in the middle. It has caused a huge amount of unnecessary anxiety and worry for service users and their families that should have been avoided. I regret that it was not avoided. I can give an assurance to service users and their families that whatever happens, the services will be protected, even if that means the HSE has to take them over. We would prefer that not to be the case and that we will be able to come to an agreement with St. John of God.

The chief executive of the HSE, Bernard Gloster, met the board of St. John of God on Sunday. Having listened to what its members had to say, he wrote to them yesterday, Monday, setting out the HSE funding that is currently available to the service and how any deficit or gap can be closed. On foot of that, he has asked them to withdraw their notice to quit the service and is awaiting a response. I echo the Deputy's comments. This should not be about the HSE, the board, the Government or politics. It should be about the service users and their families who are now being subjected to unnecessary worry and anxiety.

I am sure this can be resolved quickly between the HSE and the board of St. John of God but in the worst-case scenario, which I hope does not arise, the HSE can take over the services and we can say to them that no matter what happens, those services will continue.

Comment on this

Having studied the financial situation and having got people who would be far better at finance than I am to look at it, this is a no-brainer because if we have to provide that service through the HSE, it will inevitably cost the State a lot more than it would cost to come to an agreement with St. John of God. I am not standing up here today advocating for St. John of God. I am advocating for the service users. The right thing to do is knock the heads of the HSE, the Government and those who hold the purse strings together. St. John of God is poised to be the best option to provide the service because it is giving it as it is. To allow for continuity of service and care, the right thing to do is to negotiate. Yes, we must negotiate as hard as we can because we are trying to protect the State's money but money should not be the priority. The service users should be the priority. I am very grateful for the Taoiseach's response but I plead with him to ensure that heads will be knocked together to give peace of mind to everybody involved.

Comment on this
Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Deputy can be assured that along with the Minister, Deputy Donnelly, and the Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, I am working hard as Taoiseach to make sure this matter is resolved as soon as possible. As I mentioned earlier, the CEO of the HSE met with the board on Sunday. A proposal has been made to St. John of God that includes additional funding and a pathway to deal with legacy deficits incurred by the organisation. The HSE and St. John of God continue to work towards a positive resolution. The significant support on offer provides as pathway to financial stability and removes the need for the board to contemplate actions that could cause unnecessary distress for service users and their families. The HSE indicates that financial projections indicate that St. John of God Community Services will achieve a break-even position this year as it has done every year since 2019 and we are, therefore, hopeful that a positive outcome can be achieved in the very near future.

Comment on this