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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

RTÉ governance reports

Summary

Ivana Bacik welcomed the publication of the RTÉ governance, HR and finance reports and said the broadcaster remained in crisis. The Taoiseach said the reports provided a way forward, committed to a policy decision on future funding by summer recess, and said legislation would likely be needed.

I welcome the long-awaited publication yesterday of the three external reports examining governance, human resources and finances at RTÉ. As we review the content of those reports, however, people around the country are amazed and alarmed that our national broadcaster, the organisation to which they pay the TV licence fee every year, continues to be mired in controversy. In more than 400 pages, the reports cover barter accounts, broken relationships, feckless governance and a culture which saw perks for some and dodgy contracts for the rest. There is some startling content in there. RTÉ claimed to have lost records of the now-infamous barter account, described as "hiding in plain sight". Elsewhere, accounting transactions were described as fictitious.

It is welcome that both the Government and RTÉ have accepted all 116 recommendations in principle, particularly those relating to the scandalous treatment of staff at RTÉ. I am talking in particular about the practice of bogus self-employment contracts, which we know deprive hard-working staff of so much, including access to mortgage approval, maternity pay and pension entitlements. I have heard from people who cannot retire or take sick leave or holidays, all because RTÉ will not recognise that they are employees. Some of these people have worked in the organisation for decades. My colleague, Senator Sherlock, has spoken before about the "Upstairs, Downstairs" culture pertaining at RTÉ, where workers on bogus self-employment contracts were paying for the flaithiúlach spending of those at the top.

However, we must do more than cut, cut, cut. Curbing the excess without delivering on decency and decent standards will do as much harm as good. Already, we know that the Department of Social Protection’s scope investigation does not cover all workers who are being exploited at RTÉ. It is scandalous that any employee of a State agency should be miscategorised in this way, yet we know it was widespread at RTÉ. That is not good enough because good journalism matters. A lesser-mentioned story in the press today is that of a study carried out by Dr. Eileen Culloty, who warns that parts of Ireland risk becoming news deserts, or areas which lack a reliable news service. Throughout the country, everyone should have access to accurate and up-to-date news and information. At this time of so much fake news, it is all the more important that we are able to trust those who report the news. That is especially important of our national broadcaster, RTÉ, yet the reputation of so many hard-working journalists has been hurt by reckless governance at RTÉ.

In his limited time left in government, the Taoiseach, along with the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, and the Cabinet, have important decisions to make. We understand that RTÉ has been given six weeks to outline how the recommendations will be implemented. It also falls to the Government to make a decision and present a plan as to how to resource our national broadcaster sustainably. We know the Government has been able to commission the reports, the publication of which I have welcomed, but it is time to make decisions. When will we have an announcement on the sustainable funding model for RTÉ? As part of that announcement, will there be a dedicated fund to end the practice of bogus self-employment contracts for all at RTÉ?

Comment on this
Simon Harris The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I thank Deputy Bacik for raising this matter. I was very pleased that the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, yesterday brought to Government the three reviews into RTÉ that the Deputy referenced.

These are the reviews prepared by the independent expert advisory committees, the review of governance and culture, and the review of contractor fees, HR and other matters in RTÉ. The Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, also brought the Mazars final report on the RTÉ barter account.

I do genuinely believe these reports pave a way forward. They show us a way forward and show an opportunity to get to where Deputy Bacik aspires to be, and to where all parties and the people of the country aspire, with a better supported, better resourced, better run and better functioning RTÉ and a real value on public service broadcasting. I hope yesterday marked an opportunity to begin to turn the page in terms of not just looking back on what was a very dire situation around governance and other matters but beginning to look forward in terms of implementing the recommendations. We have been saying for a while that these two independent reports were the first reports that produced recommendations. Every other report, while valuable or useful, told us what went wrong. We now have 116 recommendations in the reports, 101 of which are for RTÉ and 15 of which are for the Government. At its meeting yesterday the Government accepted the 15 that are for us. As does Deputy Bacik, I welcome that RTÉ has accepted the recommendations. It now needs to come back to the Government within six weeks with a very robust response and implementation plan. The Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, appraised the Government yesterday of how she and her Department intend to oversee and monitor the implementation of the plan.

In relation to the issue around bogus self-employment, there were two important recommendations in the scope investigation. One was to intensify the engagement between the Department of Social Protection and RTÉ and the other was for the Department and RTÉ to positively consider a mediation process to try to help fast-track the process. This is for the very reason Deputy Bacik has highlighted, in terms of the real impact this has had on workers, often lower-paid workers in RTÉ, at a time of largesse for some. There is a sense of lower-paid workers or, quite frankly, normal workers going about their business missing out and being mistreated.

With regard to the issue of funding, this is the Government that will settle the question in terms of how to sustainably fund RTÉ and public service broadcasting. We reaffirmed this at Cabinet yesterday. The leaders of the three coalition parties, of which I am one, are committed to it. It is our intention to make a decision on funding by the summer break. It is important we do this. There are probably two options on the table. Different parties in the House have their views and I welcome this. It is good to have these debates. Ultimately there is a rubber-hits-the-road moment in terms of RTÉ responding with the full implementation plan and this being an enabler for the Government being able to make a decision once and for all on sustainable funding. I acknowledge the Trojan work done by the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, in very difficult circumstances over a sustained period of time that has helped bring us to this point today. She will be the Minister and this will be the Government who will resolve the funding issue.

Comment on this

I thank the Taoiseach for the response and for reaffirming his commitment to settle this issue in the lifetime of this Government and for providing me with the timeframe for making the decision for the sustainable future funding model by the summer recess. This is very welcome. I am mindful of the concerns expressed by Seamus Dooley of the National Union of Journalists when he responded to the publication of the reports by pointing out the real risks of delay, particularly if there is a legislative change in the funding structure. He also points out that the shadow of bogus self-employment has long lingered over RTÉ and, indeed, that it is not confined to RTÉ.

While I very much welcome the Taoiseach's provision of a timeframe for the decision on the sustainable funding model, and while I also welcome his reference to those key recommendations on ending the practice of bogus self-employment, I also ask about other organisations. Are there other State-run organisations throughout the country where this practice is an issue? Is there a plan in the Government to tackle this? As I say, I very much welcome the proposal that the Government will be making the decision on future funding models by the summer recess but the Taoiseach might explain precisely how it is to be done given the limited time left to us and given the fact we will also see local and European elections within this time period.

Comment on this
Simon Harris The Taoiseach Fine Gael

I thank Deputy Bacik. We will obviously have to work with parties in this House on any legislative proposals we bring forward. My commitment is that the Cabinet makes the policy decision on future funding by the summer recess. The Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, has been very clear that when we look through the 15 recommendations that pertain to the Government there will be a clear need for legislative change. Wherever, and somewhat regardless of where, we land on a funding model, there will need to be in addition to it a piece of legislation brought forward. My understanding is that our initial thinking is one piece of legislation to address a range of changes that are likely to be needed to the Broadcasting Act, the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General being one change I am eager to see the Government progress.

There will be a decision by the summer recess and whatever legislation will flow from that. There will be the publication of a general scheme and the opportunity for scrutiny. There is a willingness on the part of the Government to work with the Opposition in terms of how we best advance that legislation.

Comment on this