Student fees and third level costs
Deputy McDonald pressed for clarity on whether student fees will be €2,000 or €3,000 and accused the Government of uncertainty. The Taoiseach defended the Government’s investment in education, said fee decisions would be handled through the Estimates and budget process, and countered with criticism of Sinn Féin’s position in Northern Ireland.
Cuirim fáilte roimh Bridie McNally, who is here with us today. It is her birthday and she is here with a group of very lively women from County Monaghan. Fáilte agus breithlá shona duit, Bridie. She is also Deputy Bennett's mother - I should probably have said that.
Can the Taoiseach be straight with students and their parents? Can he tell them when they get their bill for their college fees in September how much they will be asked to pay? Will it be €2,000 or €3,000? That is the very simple question that has been asked since the Minister, Deputy James Lawless, went on radio and stated that without a cost-of-living package, college fees would be hiked up by €1,000. That was nine days ago. While the Taoiseach has been away in Japan, we have had a parade of senior Government Ministers in here refusing to answer that very straightforward question. The Taoiseach and the Tánaiste have dodged answering it too. The Government is ducking and diving, oblivious to the fact students are sitting down with their parents to make decisions about college now, today.
They are asking whether they can afford to go to college or to pay the extortionate rents. They are asking whether they will even be able to take up their CAO offers. Those are the questions being asked around kitchen tables.
The Taoiseach says he understands the pressure that families are under, but if he did, there is no way that a hike in fees would be on the cards. This morning’s Barnardos report reveals that many working families are forced to borrow money to pay for basics and are cutting back on essentials, while one in four parents skips meals so their children can have enough to eat. It just beggars belief that the Government is refusing to include a cost-of-living package in the budget. A €1,000 hike in college fees is a lot of money for families. We must remember that it is €1,000 per student, so if you have two or three in college, it is a big whack.
We have been inundated with messages from stressed-out students and their parents. I want to share just a few with the Taoiseach. Stephen told us:
I have two in college. Fees will cost me an extra €2000 this year! Last year, the rent for my daughter in Cork cost me ten grand. This was on top of student fees, food, travel, not to mention other expenses.
Jane wrote:
I’m going into my final year of a general nursing degree. I have to complete 30 plus placement hours a week, leaving me very little time to seek paid employment. The increase in fees [directly] affects my ability to complete my degree. No wonder so many of us flee to Australia.
Alison has two children in university with a third on the way. For one daughter, she is paying €12,000 a year just for accommodation. She said:
I’m infuriated by the proposal to increase fees by €1000 ... I am sick to the teeth with this frivolous decision.
That is just three stories but tens of thousands of students and their families are in exactly the same boat. All are now worried that they will have to find another €1,000 per student at a time when money has never been tighter. They have budgeted and made decisions based on the Government's clear commitment that college fees would not be increased. The Taoiseach owes it to them to be upfront. Tá sé thar am freagra soiléir a thabhairt do mhic léinn agus dá dteaghlach. An bhfuil a gcuid táillí á n-ardú? Cad a bheidh orthu íoc, €2,000 nó €3,000? Students and their families need the Taoiseach to answer this question: how much will they be asked to pay in September? Will it be €2,000 or €3,000? I ask him to please tell them.
Comment on this
Ní aontaím leis an Teachta. Níl aon amhras go bhfuil méadú faoi leith tar éis teacht ar líon na mac léinn atá ag freastal ar oideachas tríú leibhéal sa tír seo thar na blianta. Tá sé sin soiléir. Tá infheistíocht stairiúil curtha isteach againn le blianta beaga anuas chun tacaíocht a thabhairt do mhic léinn. Tá i bhfad níos mó infheistíochta curtha isteach sna coláistí tríú leibhéal agus ina lán nithe eile.
I came into politics because of my interest in two issues: Northern Ireland and education. Education has always been at the core of why I am in politics. The reason I joined the Fianna Fáil Party is that it was the party of Donogh O'Malley, who brought free second level education into this county. Throughout my political life, my fundamental motivation has been to ensure the children furthest behind are given priority. It is about access and participation.
We have transformed participation rates in third level education. The Deputy will never acknowledge it but that has been the reality over the last two decades. That requires significant investment. I will repeat that we are one of the top countries in the OECD as regards participation rates in third level education. Students are not flocking out of universities. It is the opposite. More and more students are seeking more and more places. There is demand and pressure to create more places. We are doing that and will continue to do so. However, no matter what happens, I will prioritise the children who are furthest behind materially and children with disabilities. I am thankful that we have made great progress in respect of children who come from what we might term disadvantaged backgrounds. The figures are quite significant.
Progression from DEIS schools to further and higher education has risen to 64%, closing the gap with non-DEIS schools at 80%. We now rank third in the OECD for tertiary attainment, with 54% of adults holding a third level qualification, well above the European Union average of 35%. At the start of the previous Government, I insisted that we would have a separate Department for higher education, research, further education and skills to give a focus on further and third level education and research. We have restored supports for PhD students, which are now substantial as a result of initiatives that have been taken. There has been an exponential rise in apprenticeships because of the focus that Department has brought to apprenticeships and skills over the past four years. Above all, we have widened access and there are a variety of instruments available to any Minister in any year in terms of prioritisation and what we do. That said, this time last year was exactly the same position because the previous year had not provided Estimates for the reduction of €1,000 that happened last year. It was exactly the same position and actually Sinn Féin had a motion down this time last year as well doing the exact same thing. There is an Estimates process and there will be a budget. We will look at the full range of supports, including fees. We will look at student supports and stronger supports for students with disabilities. We will look for stronger supports for children from economically disadvantaged backgrounds, and we will look at progression into third level from different areas, and into postgraduate and research. There is a significant menu, and lots of instruments with which we can help students, particularly those on middle and lower incomes, to make college more affordable. It is across the full gamut of instruments we have or provision we can make in the budget.
Comment on this
It is nine days since the Taoiseach's Minister took to the national airwaves to announce that there would be a hike in student fees. He did that. He took that initiative.
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Those very families the Taoiseach describes - working families and families on middle incomes - are now left in a situation where the Taoiseach cannot answer a straightforward question. It is a question they need an answer to now because they have to plan their finances for their young people going to university and college and accessing the places he has described. It is incredible that he cannot answer a straightforward question. Is it €2,000 or €3,000? I invite him again to answer that question directly because it was his Minister who raised this issue. It is the Government which has avoided answering a straightforward question for nine whole days. Those families, the parents and students, deserve a straightforward answer from the Taoiseach today. Will he please give it?
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The Minister, Deputy Lawless, did not say what the Deputy attributed to him. This is a classic performance from her, in terms of saying something that is not true. He never said that. His Estimate that was provided last year does not allow it right now, just the exact same as last year. There is an Estimates process and a budget like there is every year.
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There was an election in between.
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That issue will be addressed in that Estimates process and in the budget. SUSI grants and what we can do there will be addressed. Postgraduate supports will be addressed. Additional places in third level, which people are seeking in the areas of therapies, medicine, nursing and so on, all involve expense.
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They want to know what fees they are going to pay.
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In fairness, I think the students of Northern Ireland would appreciate a bit of clarity from Sinn Féin as to how their fees still remain at over €5,000 in Northern Ireland, and the Deputy pontificates and says this Government is not providing clarity.
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It is a Sinn Féin Minister for Finance, and they have the biggest allocation from Westminster in a long time, but they reduce everything to simplicity. We have a full range that we are going to provide-----
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In fairness to the Taoiseach, he has nothing to say.