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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Energy poverty and household arrears

Summary

Deputy Collins thanks Dáil staff, then raises the scale of energy poverty, citing new ESRI data and widespread arrears. The Tánaiste responds by welcoming the tribute, defending the surplus-funded support package, and contrasting Ireland’s approach with the UK’s borrowing-based response.

I thank the Leas Cheann-Comhairle. I might beg your indulgence for a couple of seconds before my Leader's Question. I would briefly like to say "Thank you" to Brigid McGlynn, who is finishing in the Dáil today. I wish her the very best and thank her for all her work and kindness to us all down through the years. She has been here since 1980, so we can only imagine what she has seen and heard in these corridors during that time. We want to say, "Thank you" to Brigid on behalf of everyone in the Dáil.

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Dara Calleary Minister for Social Protection Fianna Fáil

Hear, hear.

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Energy poverty is not a theory. It is a reality in kitchens and sitting rooms across the country today. This morning on "Ireland AM", it was stated that households need an extra €480 a year just to exit fuel poverty. That figure is now backed up by new ESRI research published today, which tells us that 14% of Irish households, one in seven, cannot afford adequate warmth or to pay their energy bills in full. When broader measures are taken into account, up to 30% of households are experiencing some form of energy affordability crisis. I acknowledge the packages that have been given out but the pressure is not easing on families; it is getting worse.

As of February of this year, almost 317,000 households were in arrears on their electricity bill, with the average debt approaching €500 per household and over 190,000 families trapped in arrears for more than 90 days. This is no longer short-term difficulty; it is systematic energy poverty. At the same time, the ESRI tells us that €480 a year would be enough to lift a household out of fuel poverty. That is less than what many families already owe. Yet, instead of being helped out, they are being dragged further under.

We hear the phrase "choosing between eating and heating" so often in this House that we risk becoming immune to it. People are dreading the ESB bill landing on the mat like a stealth bomb, not knowing how they will cover it. That bill never arrives alone. It arrives the week parents are trying to pay increased school transport charges. It arrives when the car is due for the NCT and needs money spent before it will pass. It arrives the same week someone in the household gets sick, costing €60 for a GP visit and €100 for medication.

The Government repeatedly tells people the solution is to move away from fossil fuels but let us be honest about that and what it costs an ordinary family. To install a solar system capable of covering heating, hot water, everyday electricity and charging a car can cost up to €20,000. The grant is a measly €1,800. That is simply not enough to encourage anyone to change over. Then comes the electric car. Any vehicle capable of a real family mileage is around €50,000. Even with grants, that remains totally out of reach for households already struggling to pay their electricity bills.

The reality is that for a normal family to fully transition from fossil fuels, the up-front cost is close to €70,000, and that is before the cost of a home charging unit is even considered. That is not a transition; it is an impossible one. My question to the Tánaiste is, will the Government increase the solar panel grants? Will the grants for heat pumps and electric cars be increased, and what is the Government going to do, in real, targeted, affordable terms, to help citizens of this country to exit fuel poverty rather than simply endure it year after year?

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Simon Harris The Tánaiste Fine Gael

I thank Deputy Collins. I join with him in wishing Brigid McGlynn all the very best. I was not aware of that. I say it from a position of affection and respect that she has been part of the furniture around here in all the time I have been here. She is quite an institution in and of her own and I wish her and her family all the very best, and indeed the best, as the Minister of State, Deputy Higgins tells me, with their Dublin Hills goat's cheese venture as well. I wish her all the very best and every health.

I thank Deputy Collins for acknowledging the package that has been put in place. We can always have a debate in this House around more, and we should, and what else can be done. The package we have put in place for farmers, fishers, farm contractors and hauliers, and the engagement we will have with contractors in the construction sector, is all an effort to recognise that, yes, a fuel and energy crisis impacts everybody in our country but there are some sectors of society and some industries that are heavily dependent on fuel and that it has a greater impact on. I welcome the generally broad welcome that there has been across those industries for these packages. Of course, it is important we keep them kind of simple and non-bureaucratic and that we get payments out as quickly as possible. I am pleased that the farm scheme will open, I think, next Tuesday as well.

I already referenced in an earlier engagement the report of the ESRI, a report we commissioned. We commissioned it as a Government because we always want to monitor what can be done in this area. It did find the fuel allowance to be effective and it talked about targeted measures. That is why I think the trajectory we are on, under the leadership of the Minister, Deputy Calleary, of expanding the fuel allowance, making sure more people than ever before are accessing it and the increases to it in recent years are all measures that make real differences to people. I have been in the homes of many people where they will tell you the difference that makes as well.

I welcome the fact that the Deputy has also referenced what more we can do. He would be the first to remind us that there are certain sectors of society that it is harder to transition away from diesel and fossil fuel. I get that, but there are also lots of people in the Deputy's constituency and mine who are trying to do the right thing by their own home and their own lives to save a few bob too. We have already made a number of changes to try to help people with electric vehicles, EVs, solar panels, windows, doors and heat pumps. In fact, the changes made by the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, only in recent weeks are already seeing a big benefit. There has been about 186% of an increase in people looking for home upgrade grants.

I have made the point - and the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, myself and everybody in Government shares this point - that we have to be constantly restless to do more in this space. One of the areas we are looking at in the time ahead, as well as having discussions about what we can do in the here and now to help people with the bills, is whether there is more we can help people do to break that cycle around being so reliant on fossil fuels and being in homes that can sometimes be cold, drafty or the likes. In the next couple of weeks, the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, will be updating Cabinet on the work of the national energy affordability task force. In addition to that, my Department of Finance is doing some work on energy economics and what the right levers are to pull to try to address energy poverty. I will be very happy to update the Deputy when we have those two pieces of work completed.

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I thank the Tánaiste for his reply. If the system was working, 317,000 households would not be in electricity arrears, with average debts close to €500 and 190,000 families stuck in long-term arrears. That is deep-rooted energy hardship and when the ESRI tells us that just €480 a year would lift a household out of fuel poverty, it is indefensible that people are being allowed to sink further into debt instead of being helped over that line.

I see Government saying in the past week that it is forecasting a €9.2 billion surplus. Great news, and we have a rainy day fund. In 2023, it was estimated at €6 billion. This is a rainy day. It could not be wetter out there for the people of this country, besides the sun over my head right now. The point is that rainy day fund should be put back into people who are struggling badly. The surplus needs to be focused on families who are at home, scared of the electricity bill coming in the door and not being able to pay the bill. Those are the facts of the matter. People cannot heat their homes on announcements; they need targeted supports.

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Simon Harris The Tánaiste Fine Gael

I would make a couple of points on the surplus. First, it is better to have one than not have one, and it has enabled us to bring in a €750 million package of supports, one of the largest in the European Union, and not have to borrow for it. If you look at our nearest neighbours in the UK, they brought in a smaller package for their citizens per head of population. They had to borrow and were charged around 5% on the market for that as well. We are using the fact that we have a fiscal buffer to the advantage of our citizens in being able to have a larger package in place but also not having to borrow and pay interest for that package as well.

To reassure people, I would also make the point that the €9.4 billion is not sitting in the Department of Finance getting dusty. This is a projection as to what we believe the surplus could be by the end of the year. It has not come in yet. This is the month of April; it is what we believe the surplus could be by 31 December. I think that sometimes gets missed in this debate. There is not €9.4 billion of a surplus sitting over there now.

The third point I would make, and I say this respectfully, is that in the past perhaps people talked of rainy day funds. We do not have any such fund in Ireland any more. We have two funds that are very clearly actively being used, one around infrastructure, climate adaptation, capital projects, metro potentially and for other things, and another called the Future Ireland Fund, for demographics, including a population that is going to get older in the Deputy's constituency and mine. We do have options in terms of being able to do more in the time ahead but the politics and the facts of the surplus are a little more complicated than is sometimes presented.

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