I hope colleagues will assist when I break with the normal rules of not welcoming anyone during Leaders' Questions. Today we have a very special welcome in giving a big, warm céad míle fáilte to an incredible young man, Mr. Austin Appelbee, age 13. Deputies may have heard Austin's story from February this year, when he undertook an incredible act of bravery in Western Australia. In order to save the lives of his mother Joanne, his brother Beau and his sister Grace, Austin undertook a four-hour, 4 km swim followed by a 2 km run to contact emergency services, which ultimately led to everyone being rescued by emergency services. What an incredible feat. We are delighted to have Austin and his family here today in the Public Gallery. You are most welcome.

Fáilte, Austin. Deputy Carthy is telling me that Austin is a Monaghan man. The Ceann Comhairle missed the most important element of the story. Comhghairdeas agus fáilte.

Three years on from the financial scandals that rocked RTÉ, the State broadcaster is once again embroiled in controversy. The latest debacle centres on RTÉ revising the list of its top ten highest earning presenters to include Mr. Derek Mooney. It transpires that Mr. Mooney should have been on the list for the last five years, but his salary of almost €200,000 was kept a secret by the top brass at RTÉ. Strangely, in 2020, Mr. Mooney's role was reclassified as a producer rather than a presenter, although the dogs in the street know that Derek Mooney is a presenter. RTÉ's top earners' list was incorrect eight years in a row - transparency out the window again.

People will remember the secret payments and the slush fund controversies, scandals which revealed a shocking absence of oversight and governance, exposing a culture of arrogance and entitlement, RTÉ top brass flaithiúlach with the use of public money. Despite a massive bailout and big promises from the Government and from RTÉ, what really has changed? Once again, the Minister in charge of all of this, Deputy O'Donovan, knows nothing. All of this latest debacle is news to him. This morning he brought legislation to Cabinet to put the broadcaster under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General. This is years after the Committee of Public Accounts said that should happen; it is Government in slow motion. The Irish public bailed out RTÉ to the tune of €725 million, almost three quarters of a billion euro.

That is a lot of taxpayers' money. However, there is little evidence of the change that people expected. Top management still plays fast and loose, not reporting accurately the big salaries of the high-flyers. Why is this? It is because the Government has failed to take on the prevailing culture of arrogance and privilege. The privileges gifted by the Government to RTÉ stands in stark contrast to how it treats working people and families. The budget of €9.4 billion last October left working people worse off, forced to watch every euro they spend, with their backs to the wall trying to keep up with rising prices, and doing all of the right things but still struggling to just get by. There is no bailout for them and no help from the Government but RTÉ top management is handed €750 million in public money and continues to take the taxpayers for fools.

We have here a tale of two Irelands, with working people playing by the rules abandoned by the Government and told to tighten their belts, and top brass executives at RTÉ who believe the rules do not apply to them and believe they can do what they want without consequence. This needs to be nipped in the bud. The Government needs to sort this out, and fast. Rinne muintir na hÉireann RTÉ a tharrtháil le €725 milliún. Masla amach is amach is ea an chonspóid is déanaí d’oibrithe atá ag streachailt is ag comhaireamh gach uile phingin. Bringing RTÉ under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General is long overdue but it cannot stop there. People want accountability and consequences. Does the Taoiseach accept that the Government's failure to act decisively has allowed this bad behaviour at RTÉ and this culture of entitlement to continue?

Hear, hear.

I do not agree with Deputy McDonald's assertions once again. No matter what any State agency does, or what anybody out there does, she will blame the Government. That is her standard practice. The Government is at fault for everything. Her latest assertion is that the Government must now run RTÉ. Just think about that and reflect on it. Is that what Deputy McDonald is actually saying, that politicians should go in there and run the national public service broadcaster? That is what she is saying.

You give them money and then run away.

I know she has to do this for electoral reasons and politics and to play the game but there is a serious undercurrent here, and coming from the Sinn Féin Party it will create its own challenges in good time and I want to put that on the record.

I would say what has happened is unacceptable. The Minister has had a meeting, or will meet, the director general today. Deputy McDonald made a comment on the legislation. The Minister brought it before Cabinet today. Again, she implied that he was at fault for the delay in bringing the legislation. That is not true.

Whose job is it to bring legislation?

Could you afford the Taoiseach the respect that your leader got?

The Oireachtas pre-legislative scrutiny took a considerable length of time. Deputy McDonald's party and members were involved in this legitimately. Please do not come in here, after taking time on pre-legislative scrutiny, and then say the Minister is acting in slow motion.

We brought forward the legislation a few years ago.

That is the kind of dishonesty that characterises every one of her presentations here in recent times on Leaders' Questions. She does not really care about the truth any more. Whenever something breaks out, let us have a go at the Government and let us blame the Government and that is it. It is a simple formula and that is what Deputy McDonald is about.

I do not believe the current management is laissez-faire. I do think it wants to get to grips with this. That is my assessment, and I think the board does as well. Yes, everybody knew Derek Mooney was a presenter and not a producer. Deputy McDonald said the dogs on the street knew it but I would say that the dogs in the wild knew it-----

Deputies, please.

-----in terms of his role. There may be others. What this speaks to is a lack of structure in terms of how people are recruited, designated and treated from a human resource point of view in RTÉ. The wider issue that the bonnet needs to be lifted on is whether there is consistency across the organisation in respect of the treatment of people and the treatment of employees of the company. There is a real disparity in terms of how some are treated compared to how others have been treated, and this is a problem for RTÉ that needs to be sorted out. There needs to be far more transparency than we have experienced in recent years in terms of this issue.

In terms of the funding issue, collectively, as an Oireachtas, we need to make up our mind on whether or not we want public service broadcasting and a national broadcaster. These are options that politics can take. We can decide to abandon public service broadcasting altogether and just have a free for all. I do not agree with that but just saying that when Deputy McDonald has a go at the €700 million, there are choices facing the Government.

You either cut it down, undermine it, let it go to waste or let it go private. What is the Deputy saying? Is she saying the €700 million should not have gone into it?

There should be accountability.

That is rhetorical, Deputy.

I fully agree with that, and that is what the Minister is doing. It is going to the C and AG, and it will be before the public accounts committee. It took some time to get through the Houses, but the Minister is doing that. It took some time because of you guys, rightly. I have no issue with pre-legislative scrutiny, but you cannot blame the Minister for delays with pre-legislative scrutiny. They cannot do that. They cannot get away with that kind of stuff and I am not going to let them get away with it. An rud is tábhachtaí ná go mbeidh soiléiriú ann maidir le RTÉ ar chúrsaí pá, costais, caighdeáin, agus coinníollacha a bhaineann leis sin, agus go bhfuil cothrom na Féinne á tabhairt do gach éinne atá ag obair laistigh de RTÉ. Tá sé sin ríthábhachtach. Táimid den tuairim go gcaithfidh RTÉ sin a dhéanamh agus táim muiníneach as an Aire go bhfuil seisean go láidir den tuairim sin chomh maith.

Unfortunately, the Taoiseach is very touchy about the idea that he might be expected to do his job and do it competently. A key function of the Government is to ensure that State agencies, including RTÉ, are accountable and that an agency such as RTÉ, which has been bailed out to the tune of almost three quarters of a billion euro, behaves in a manner that is transparent and appropriate, so we do not see a rerun of the scandals that rocked RTÉ a short time ago. All of us were led to believe that the bargain with RTÉ was that it would be bailed out and funded and that public broadcasting would be supported and, by way of return, that there would be a change in behaviour and culture, appropriate standards and accurate and transparent reporting. We now know that is not the case and-----

Time is up, Deputy. I ask the Taoiseach to respond.

-----that is on the Taoiseach and the "I don't know what's going on" Minister, Deputy Patrick Donovan-----

The Deputy's time is up and the Taoiseach will respond.

-----who apparently shrugged his shoulders and did a Manuel on it. He knows nothing apparently. He needs to start finding out.

The Minister has brought through the legislation that will bring RTÉ under the remit of the Comptroller and Auditor General, which is a stronger regime of public accountability for RTÉ than has been the case hitherto. There has always been sensitivity in the relationship between the political system and RTÉ. In the midst of all the turmoil and noise, we need to keep an eye on that too. It will go before the public accounts committee. Deputy Carthy can laugh away because it would be of no concern to him.

Stop it, would you?

If he could run RTÉ, he would run it in the interests of his party. That is how you guys operate and would operate.

Wise up. What sort of child are you?

The point I am making is that the Minister, Deputy O'Donovan, is meeting with the director general and the chairman of RTÉ today. I believe they are making a sincere effort to try to get this reorganised. There has been some progress made but what has happened is unacceptable. What is more important is that there is consistency across the board in RTÉ in terms of how people are treated from a human resources point of view and that rights and conditions apply to everybody in RTÉ and not just some.

It sounds like you want to run RTÉ, not Matt Carthy.

Before I call Deputy Bacik, I remind Members to respect everybody's contributions. They are of equal importance.