Everyone is welcome. Before we proceed, I have a few housekeeping matters to go through.

I wish to explain some limitations to parliamentary privilege and the practice of the House as regards references the witnesses make to other persons in their evidence. Witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of the presentations they make to the committee. This means that they have an absolute defence against any defamation action in respect of anything they say at the meeting. This is for witnesses who are present within the parliamentary precincts. However, witnesses are expected not to abuse this privilege, and it is my duty, as Chair, to ensure the privilege is not abused. Therefore, if their statements are potentially defamatory in relation to an identifiable person or entity, witnesses will be asked to discontinue their remarks. It is imperative they comply with any such direction.

I advise members of the constitutional requirement that they must be physically present within the confines of the Leinster House complex in order to participate in public meetings. I will not permit a member to participate when they are not adhering to this constitutional requirement. Therefore, any member who attempts to participate from outside the precincts will be asked to leave the meeting. In this regard, I ask any member participating via Microsoft Teams that, prior to making their contribution to the meeting, they confirm that they are on the grounds of the Leinster House campus.

Members and witnesses are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice that they should not criticise or make charges against any person or entity by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable, or otherwise engage in speech that might be regarded as damaging to the good name of the person or entity. Therefore, if their statements are potentially defamatory in relation to an identifiable person or entity, they will be directed to discontinue their remarks. It is imperative that they comply with any such direction.

No. 1 on today's agenda is our engagement with the Competition and Consumer Protection Commission, CCPC. The topics we look forward to discussing with the CCPC include the state of competition in Ireland reports for December 2025 on issues including barriers to entry, barriers to expansion and services sector analysis.

No. 2 is the fuel report published in March 2026. As Cathaoirleach, I want to take a moment to reflect that the last seven days have been a very difficult time for consumers, as have the last number of months. This has been particularly exacerbated by the international crisis spurred on by the conflict in Iran. This committee has a strong duty to consumers in Ireland to help identify challenges and solutions and help the public understand some of the difficulties with respect to the cost of living and issues they are facing. On No. 2 in particular, members may have some things they wish to raise and I wanted to flag that. Whitegate is in my constituency and it has been a very challenging week for people in Cork East and all over the country. No. 2 is of the utmost importance and as Cathaoirleach I would like to see us getting some information on that.

No. 3 is the general scheme of the data Bill. The committee would also like to hear about the role of the CCPC in that forthcoming Bill. The CCPC will be aware that competitiveness and the cost of doing business are priority policy issues for the committee and we look forward to hearing any views commission representatives may have on those matters.

I propose that we publish the opening statements provided by the witnesses on the committee's website. Is that agreed? Agreed. As for speaking arrangements, we should invite our witnesses to speak for approximately ten minutes and then allow members to ask questions and make comments for approximately seven minutes each. If time permits, we may allow for an additional round of questions when members may ask questions for up to four minutes. Members will be called as they appear on the week 2 speaking rota, which has been circulated. Committee members may substitute within their party or political grouping. Attendees who are not members of the committee or substitutes may speak only after committee members or substitutes have done so. Is that agreed? Agreed.

I am delighted to welcome the representatives of the CCPC to the meeting. I welcome Mr. Brian McHugh, chairperson, Mr. Geoffrey Gray, member of the commission, Mr. Simon Barry, director of research, advocacy and international, and Ms Síona Ryan, director of digital and data regulation. You are all very welcome and thank you for being here.

I invite Mr. McHugh to make his opening statement.

Good afternoon Cathaoirleach and members of the committee. Both Ireland and the wider EU have identified competitiveness as a priority area. We know we cannot deliver a competitive economy that serves consumers without strong competition operating on a level playing field. The CCPC has recently published its state of competition analysis, which provides an overview of how Ireland’s economy is performing. We will discuss today the state of competition in Ireland and the work the CCPC is progressing to deliver open markets that enhance consumer welfare.

As members know, the CCPC is responsible for promoting competition and protecting consumers and we are focused on the work that will have the biggest positive impact on both the economy as a whole and the individual consumer. We were last before this committee in November 2025, just shy of six months ago. In that time, we have taken major consumer protection and competition enforcement actions, published key research and advocacy reports, and hit major milestones in progressing our new competition powers.

Beginning with enforcement action, the CCPC had a major win in a school bus transport cartel case, with a unanimous Central Criminal Court guilty verdict for engaging in an anti-competitive practice known as bid-rigging. We also prosecuted a Kildare-based car dealer for misleading a consumer about the history of a second-hand car. Since we were last here, our consumer protection enforcement teams published several enforcement actions. Some particularly notable ones include: compliance notices to high-profile influencers for failing to disclose the commercial nature of their social media content; undertakings secured to address compliance concerns from several retailers; and fixed payment notices to several traders for failing to display product prices. The CCPC also prosecuted Brown Thomas Arnotts, which subsequently pleaded guilty to breaking sales pricing laws. The outcome in this case was a €1,000 contribution to charity. This is the same result as in the prosecutions against Tesco, Boots and Lifestyle Sports that we recently discussed with the committee.

While this was an important outcome, we have long advocated for stronger powers to tackle consumer protection law. We believe the potential for consumer detriment is extremely high and we want financial penalties that match the crime. Therefore, we welcome the proposed consumer protection, competition and enforcement Bill 2026, which includes administrative financial sanctions for consumer law and look forward to it progressing. Our anti-trust team secured policy changes with Chartered Accountants Ireland to remove competition restrictions relating to the recruitment of trainee accountants. The anti-trust team also announced a home appliances investigation and carried out dawn raids in Ireland and Germany.

In January, we published our annual mergers and acquisitions report for 2025, which highlighted a very successful year for our mergers team. There were 90 mergers notified in 2025, which was almost a 10% increase since 2024 and a 32% increase since 2023. We used our simplified merger notification process for 64% of our determinations and this delivered a reduced average clearance time of 12.5 working days. However, where necessary, we also intervened to protect competition, requiring divestments in deals across sectors including telecoms infrastructure, retail fuel supply, hotels and wholesale groceries. Last month, we issued our assessment of a merger in the laundry services sector, which sets out our provisional concerns about the deal’s potential to substantially lessen competition. This is a key service sector for the hospitality industry and so has an important impact on tourism and the economy. We also used our new call-in power for the first time to review Uniphar’s acquisition of TouchStore in the pharmacy sector. These powers allow us to ensure we can review potentially anti-competitive mergers that fall below our thresholds for mandatory notification. We also welcomed Government proposals to raise the thresholds for merger notifications. Together, call-in powers and increasing our revenue thresholds will allow us to focus resources on potentially problematic deals and reduce red tape for businesses.

We have published several important reports, including our state of competition work, and advocated for some key solutions that we believe would dramatically improve consumers’ lives and strengthen market competitiveness. Some examples include: new research and guidance on tipping and service charges; a report into Ireland’s home buying market, which recommended that home buyers be provided with full and transparent information before making what is likely to be the biggest financial decision of their lives; and research into the taxi industry, which included strong recommendations about opening up the market to help address the severe supply shortage faced by consumers, particularly in rural Ireland. In March, the CCPC conducted a rapid, high-level analysis of the home heating oil and motor fuel markets in light of the ongoing conflict in the Middle East and resultant impacts on fuel prices.

While the distress facing consumers is very real, our report found that the high retail prices were driven by sharp increases in wholesale prices.

Earlier this week, you will likely have seen the publication of our annual helpline report, which details key insights from over 40,000 consumers who contacted us last year and which, for the first time, includes insights from ongoing consumer outcomes research, examining the effectiveness of consumer rights in practice.

The CCPC also finalised its competition adjudication rules and guidelines and welcomed a new panel of independent adjudication officers appointed by the Minster at the end of November 2025. These are significant milestones in strengthening our competition powers. The CCPC also welcomed the appointment of Geoffrey Gray, who is here today, as a member of the commission in January. His expertise will be invaluable as we implement strengthened laws for both competition and consumer protection.

The real-life impact of the CCPC was also highlighted in our impact report, which showed that between 2021 and 2024, the CCPC’s total operating cost of the relevant intervention areas was €32 million and the estimated consumer benefit over that period was €682 million. That means that for every €1 spent on the CCPC, it gives a consumer benefit of €21.

I thank the committee for inviting us here today to discuss our state of competition report, an important piece of work completed by the CCPC since we last appeared before you. This landmark study examined several indicators of competition over a 15-year period to assess how competition has evolved across Ireland’s services sector. It found an overall increase in concentration across multiple service industries meaning that in a number of areas, a smaller number of companies now account for a greater share of activity. That matters because, if left unchecked, such trends can weaken competitive pressure over time, with possible adverse consequences for prices, choice, innovation and consumer outcomes for households and businesses alike.

Importantly, this is not a development unique to Ireland. Similar analysis undertaken internationally has identified comparable patterns in other economies. While our findings do not in themselves point to an immediate or serious cause for alarm, they do underline the need to avoid complacency and to continue monitoring how competition is developing across the Irish economy. They also reinforce the importance of an active and proactive national competition authority.

Looking ahead, we will continue to prioritise consumer rights, safeguard fair markets and enforce the law within our remit. While many of the CCPC’s recommendations have been implemented over time, there are still areas where reforms have yet to be actioned. We are always happy to discuss how best to ensure our recommendations effectively feed into the decision-making process. Markets that continue to be a focus for us include the taxi market, the home buying market, the waste sector and the legal services sector, to name a few.

I am extremely proud of the CCPC’s work and we welcome the strengthening of our powers in recent years. Our remit continues to expand, including our new digital, data and product safety functions. In the context of these new functions, it is important to note that the CCPC received no significant additional funding in the 2026 budget. We will continue to prioritise the work that has the most impact but resources remain a challenge in ensuring that Ireland retains a strong competitive economy that delivers for consumers. We look forward to further engagement with the committee on future legislation. We are happy to answer any questions.

Thank you very much. We now move to our members and invite them to speak.

I welcome the witnesses. I have a couple of different points from the opening statement and the reports that have been done, which are very useful in terms of the state of competition.

Unsurprisingly, the first point relates to the analysis of the home hearing oil and motor fuel markets. Mr. McHugh said the report found "the high retail prices were driven by sharp increases in wholesale prices." We are not unique in that not a lot of our supply comes through the Gulf region and, indeed, other countries like Norway, which has its own supply, have had price hikes. What, in the CCPC's analysis, is the cause of the wholesale price hikes? It is clearly not a restriction in supply because many of the people who have experienced price hikes have sufficient supply and in some cases have their own supplies. Yet, we have price hikes right across the world which are causing untold damage, particularly here, as we can see, across Ireland recently That has followed on from cost-of-business and cost-of-living increases and stresses on people trying to sustain small businesses and farms across the country. In the CCPC's analysis, what is driving that spike because it is clearly not a lack of supply, even with the ongoing pressure in the Hormuz area?

Regarding the proposed legislation which is coming forward in the consumer protection and competition enforcement Bill, the fine of €1,000 would be a drop in the ocean for some of the companies that were mentioned. What does the CCPC anticipate in terms of a more significant financial penalty as a consequence of that legislation? This €1,000 is not even a rap on the knuckles for most of those firms in terms of financial penalties.

In relation to the state of competition, there are some worrying trends about the difficulty in people both getting into business and in growing and expanding. For anyone who represents rural constituencies there is a worrying trend between what happens in the Dublin area and in the rest of the country. There seem to be much more significant barriers. There has long been a sense that the focus on foreign direct investment has been very beneficial but that the tax take from it is something that is increasingly volatile in today's world and that there needs to be much more concentration on developing, growing, sustaining and helping the export businesses locally in Ireland. What is the CCPC's sense in terms of the Government's priorities in that regard? The CCPC is identifying very significant barriers. There has long been talk around the need for more diversity in the economy. I know this report is restricted to the service industry but in general terms around more diversity, what is the CCPC's sense of where the Government is at in relation to that and are we likely to see the step change that the report clearly identifies is needed in the time ahead?

I will address the question on the wholesale prices and the legislation. I might ask Mr. Barry to talk about the barriers we identified in the state of competition report. In terms of the fuel report we have published, one of the headlines was that the very real pain Irish consumers are suffering is driven by wholesale prices and they have fed through to retail prices. In respect of the Senator's question as to why wholesale prices increased, that was not the basis of the report but we have seen a very large supply shock in the industry and while there is supply, it is significantly reduced and the risk has significantly increased. As we know, oil is effectively a global commodity. When we get a supply shock in an area like the Strait of Hormuz, we will see a reaction in the markets in terms of how people will price oil, what risk they view of not being able to get supply at some point in the future. We see bids on shipments even while they are at sea. Ships will turn around and go to some place that has bid higher. So, we are seeing people reacting to that supply shock, reacting to that risk and the price of oil has significantly increased for that reason.

Does Mr. McHugh have any concern that given there is a small number of large cartels in charge of that wholesale pricing, there can be some market manipulation in terms of taking advantage of a crisis in order to hike the price up for countries?

The oil market is the source of one of the most famous cartels that there is, namely, the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries, OPEC, which is run by countries. So, it is a market with huge market power and those countries do co-operate in order to influence prices. That absolutely does happen and it happens on a global scale. In terms of the pain that people are suffering, which is very real, it is a global phenomenon. We engage regularly with our international colleagues and every country, not just in Europe, but in the world, in trying to figure out how to manage the situation as best they can. However, in all of those countries it is driven by the wholesale price.

Regarding the Senator's second question on the legislation, we strongly agree that a €1,000 contribution to charity in some instances does not match the harm suffered by consumers. We see cases where literally millions of Irish consumers have in our view been harmed. We are dealing with companies with turnovers in the billions. What we see in other areas such as competition enforcement or data protection and elsewhere are fines linked to turnover - often global turnover. Again, it will depend on the legislation. It can be up to 10% of global turnover, however, so we have very strong powers in terms of competition again linked to percentage of turnover so we would expect to see similar powers included in the legislation. We would then also set out clearly the guidelines on how those fines will be calculated. Again, that is very similar to competition. As one would expect, the fines are linked to the harm that is caused in the market where the breach of the law occurred. For us, one of the big issues is the deterrent effect. As companies in Ireland make their business decisions, they know that if they do not get that IT system right to comply with consumer law, the worst that might happen is a €1,000 contribution to charity. We have no doubt that as they make all their decisions, that is one factor which means that consumers in Ireland do not get a great service sometimes.

Is Mr. McGrath's sense that the legislation is going to move in the area of percentage of turnover?

That is our expectation. In terms of the state of competition and the barriers, we did a specific piece of analysis on the barriers we see. We were not surprised by some of the areas where we think action is needed.

A special module of our analysis on the services sector looked at barriers to competition. We looked separately at barriers to entry into new markets and barriers to expansion because in our experience, that is commonly a way in which competitive forces are prevented from taking hold in a market in a way that suppresses competitive pressure. There are many strands of conclusion that emerged, but I will summarise some of the ones we extracted as some of the core themes. One theme was around the legal and regulatory framework where firms reported legal fees and processes associated with operating in a market as a barrier to entry. Difficulty accessing particular technologies and how to navigate the regulatory environment was flagged to us. Another prominent theme was financial capacity, which covers a range of different issues, including the ability of firms to generate profitability to support their own financial position but also, importantly, included references to access to credit financing and capital.

With regard to barriers to expansion, businesses told us that a lack of information about market opportunities both at home and abroad was something that they identified as holding them back. In terms of what we have taken from the conclusions that we found through the research we undertook, it really underlines the importance of some of our pro-competition advocacy work in some key sectors, including legal services, banking and finance where we continue to view those sectors as really important sectors for us. We continue to promote the messaging associated with the benefits of targeting reforms in some of those areas and we have been very active in promoting the findings of our search across a wide stakeholder base. We continue to do that and we use the evidence from the research to continue to build our priorities as we think about markets that we are going to target for future work, be that on the research or advocacy side or the enforcement side.

In terms of the broader picture of rebalancing the economy, there is a sense that a lot of the eggs are in the one basket of foreign direct investment. We have to take into account the tax take in that regard and the volatility of that. It has been identified for some time that there is a risk in that and that the counterbalance is obviously to try to develop indigenous businesses. In light of these reports and of needs to be done, is there a sense that the Government is addressing that and is exercised by the fact that rebalancing needs to take place and knows that significant barriers to that have been identified by the CCPC?

We have engaged actively with a number of branches of Government, including the Department and the National Council for Productivity and Competitiveness. We are also actively involved in the cost of business advisory forum. We have engaged with the Central Bank and have a number of other kind of stakeholder outlets. We are continuing to push this message. We take any and all available opportunities to reinforce the messages from our research in general but this is a particularly important one. This was a one of the largest pieces of research the CCPC has ever undertaken. We believe in the evidence base it is providing and we will continue to use it as we continue to develop our pro-competition advocacy positions and priorities.

I thank the witnesses for being here and for the work they do. It is incredibly valuable. We live in a very challenging world. The economic environment is very challenging, particularly for consumers, so the work that CCPC is doing and has done is invaluable and I thank the witnesses for that. I recognise and acknowledge that. It is quality work that is making a very significant contribution so I thank the witnesses for that at the outset.

We talk about the cost-of-living crisis, but I would like to focus for a moment or two on consumers. Increasingly consumers are price conscious and value conscious. Affordability is very elusive for most consumers from my experience. When we talk about online shopping, many people are shopping online not because they do not want to support their local shop or outlet but because they are looking for value for money. They are looking for a more affordable solution to their needs. The frustrations that consumers can encounter in the online shopping environment in terms of a product not arriving or arriving but not being as it appeared when advertised online. In the latter case, the difficulty then lies in returning it or getting a refund. There are real frustrations and real costs for consumers in this regard. There is the cost of not having their needs met in the first instance, the waste of their time and the frustration involved and everything that goes with that.

Another matter consumers regularly raise with me relates to their frustration when it comes to dealing with issues and services for home maintenance and construction. Issues around the quality of work, the cost of the work and the final bill they receive can be really frustrating. Consumers feel very alone in that space. They are dealing with professionals and experts in their fields where the consumer is not an expert. The consumer is looking to get work done in what is the most essential environment for them, namely their home. When that work falls short of their needs, what they expected and what, on many occasions, they may have paid for, it really undermines them. It is not just a financial loss, it also undermines their quality of life and their sense of self-confidence. It is a major issue. The CCPC has certain powers, but my understanding is that it does not actually have powers to resolve an individual complaint between an individual consumer and a provider. Do the witnesses think the law needs to be changed to correct that?

I thank the Senator for her opening comments. Our staff in the CCPC work incredibly hard and are very motivated by improving consumer welfare. It is nice for them to hear thanks from someone like a Senator.

The issues raised by the Senator are our bread-and-butter issues. They are what we deal with. Every day, we get over 40,000 contacts and complaints from consumers across a variety of sectors, but those identified by the Senator are the ones we deal with every day. We do provide advice to consumers. We provide specific kind of advice and guidance in terms of things like home maintenance and construction.

It is a very big issue in terms of the outlay for consumers. There is home buying, buying a car and home maintenance. These are some of the biggest things you will spend money on. We provide that guidance. We always look to improve whatever information we can provide both to the consumer and businesses on their responsibilities. The home maintenance and construction sector will always remain a priority for us.

Another important element for us is that one of the solutions is the small claims court, which can be very successful in resolving issues. The problem we see is that the level is very low in terms of getting into the small claims court, so we are seeking to raise the threshold for the type of purchase issue brought to that court to €8,000. We understand that it might not solve all issues, but consumers are facing more and more issues they currently cannot bring to the small claims court. That is one step.

Turning the CCPC into an ombudsman to deal with individual complaints would be a very significant change to what we do and can do. It is not something that we are seeking to do. There are over 40,000 contacts every year and to put an infrastructure in place to do that would be a huge challenge. It would fundamentally change the focus of what the CCPC does. We continue to believe that providing consumers with their rights so they feel empowered to understand what their rights are and tell the relevant businesses is one step. Many businesses are very happy to comply with the law but telling them what their responsibilities are is another step. Where businesses do not comply, prosecuting or enforcing up to prosecution and fining them so that there is that deterrent effect, is in our view is the most efficient package that we see. Again, we look internationally as well at what others do in being able to deliver strong consumer rights that are enforceable and that consumers can use. As I mentioned, for us, having businesses' systems in place that automatically follow consumer law and ensure consumer rights are upheld is the most efficient outcome.

The witnesses are very welcome to the committee. I thank the CCPC for the very valuable work that it does, which is most important in the current times we all find ourselves in.

I have a couple of questions on the cost of living. We are inundated with correspondence from people who would never write to public representatives but find themselves put to the pin of their collar at the minute. Do we have any data on the retailing of fuel in terms of retailers' margins? I will give a couple of examples that I found quite concerning, which were supplied to me as late as 30 seconds ago, on the fluidity of fuel pricing. One came from a small to medium family-run business in Wexford operating on the fuel card system. Yesterday, 15 April, that business was quoted €1.49 per litre of diesel, excluding VAT, by their supplier. If 23% VAT is added to that, I will let the Chairman use his mathematical genius to work that out. Today, that business owner messaged me and sent me screenshots of his quotation, which is €1.39 per litre today, excluding VAT. Let us contrast that with what is being charged at forecourts. We have small retailers, but many of them are franchises of massive conglomerates in terms of the main suppliers. What data do we have in that area? The prices this business owner has been quoted are substantially less than what people are paying on the forecourt to fill their cars.

I will give an example of some of the messages he sent me, which state that the latest fuel prices, effective on 16 April 2026, are diesel at €1.39.8, kerosene at €1.35.7 and petrol €1.42.26. That is the latest update this morning with the excise reduced. That is €1.72, including VAT, for diesel. That is substantially less than what people are paying on the forecourts. I appreciate there are relatively small, or small to medium retailers, involved but they are supplying people, as they pull up in their cars as they try to get to work, at a substantially greater price per litre than this person is being provided with. What information do we have about what is on the forecourts in terms of retailers? Can we get that information? Does the CCPC have that information? Is that something that the CCPC has the power to investigate? If we are banging the drum in Dáil Éireann and condemning the handling of the fuel crisis but this is happening out on the highways and byways across the country, then there are questions that must be asked of people who have not been questioned yet.

As I said, there are massive businesses. I am not going to name them. We all know who they are. Every second garage belongs to a particular company name, maybe with a circle on it. It is buying fuel at substantially lower prices than the consumer is paying. We need to question that. We also see it in the supermarket industry, where we do not know what profits it is making. They do not release their profit data in Ireland. I believe they do in other countries but not in Ireland, yet people are pushing their trolleys up to the till in fear of what the total will be just to exist. I would be grateful if Mr. McHugh could give me some sort of response to that.

In the report, and in general when we look at any market, we always look at profit margins as it is one of the key indicators. We set out the profit margins that we could access and were publicly available in the report we recently produced. The margins of those companies were between 2% and 4%, which are comparable with the margins that we see from those type of companies in other jurisdictions.

Similarly, we did a number of reviews of the grocery sector. Again, we looked at margins. Quite a number of the margins of the Irish grocery sector are published. Not all of them are - the Deputy is correct on that - but quite a number of them are. Again, the margins are between 2% and 4%. These tend to be very high volume and relatively lower-margin industries anyway. Those are the type of profit margins those companies are making. That is what we set out in the report.

In 2022, we did a much more in-depth study of the fuel market and petrol and diesel. We took hourly figures from hundreds of petrol stations. We looked at the supply chain and broke it down as to how the industry worked, what made up the price that the consumer paid and we set that out. Again, from our experience of that market, the idea of margins of 2% to 4% did not surprise us when it is what we saw in the recent report. None of this changes the fact that consumers, and we hear from them every day on our helpline, are suffering real pain and that this is a massive problem for families throughout Ireland. We understand that, but we do not see evidence for the idea that a key part of the problem is significant profits being made in an uncompetitive market.

Is Mr. McHugh satisfied that the CCPC is not seeing evidence of any gouging, as it has been described, over recent times?

Yes.

That is despite the fact of the figures I gave in relation to today, after the reduction, of diesel at €1.39, excluding VAT, albeit with a fuel card. That is substantially lower.

Yes.

A margin of 2% to 4% does not make sense to me on that.

We have received over 1,000 complaints and a lot of information. We welcome complaints from all consumers because that is how we get our information and it can be really useful.

When we look overall at the fuel market, we looked at how prices have changed in that period at the start of March. We set it all out in the report. A lot of the data we set out is publicly available though not all of it is. We found that what drove that price increase was wholesale prices. If you go back to the 2022 report - we had so much data at that time it took us eight months to do as it is very in-depth - you see certain days where certain petrol stations will make higher profits.

The Competition and Consumer Protection Commission is satisfied that on diesel at €2 a litre, to take a round figure, the profit is between 4 cent and 8 cent at the retailer?

Yes. We are satisfied that the real pain consumers are facing is not driven by high profits outside of what would normally be expected in a market like fuel. The margins we see and saw previously are around 2% to 4%.

I thank Mr. McHugh and his team for coming in to us today. The CCPC is a very important commission in a small open-market economy like Ireland. We appreciate the work it does. Regulation must strike the right balance in protecting competition without stifling enterprise. Deputy Lawlor brought up some very valid points but as the Fianna Fáil representative for small- and medium-sized enterprises and retail, I have to say the retail shops I represent are working on the margins Mr. McHugh spoke about and in a lot of cases they are on the lower end of that at 2%. Over the past number of weeks, people with service stations have told me they have been losing money on petrol and diesel because they bought a day or two earlier and then prices went back down but to attract customers to their premises, they had to lower the price so they were selling petrol and diesel at a loss. While there is a situation like that which Deputy Lawlor mentioned, we do not want the message going out from this committee that all retailers are doing similar; they are absolutely not. They are looking after the people in their areas, providing a service and in some cases they are making a loss. The review by the CCPC was asked for by the Minister for enterprise. It is a valuable piece of work. The results did not reflect what was felt on the ground but obviously the CCPC researched it, got into the minutiae and was able to decipher from that that price gouging was not going on. My point for the CCPC is they were able very quickly to put up the prices when the international markets changed but they are not as quick to bring down the prices when international markets change.

It is a good point.

I thank Deputy McCormack for the question. We found in 2022 that some petrol stations on some days lose money. That would match the Deputy's experience. Generally, prices come down as quickly as they go up. That is what we found in 2022. We looked at the excise cut and how quickly it was passed through. As for whether it is exact, I would not claim that it is perfect every day and we looked day by day. There might be a case where it might take an extra day. Just like we see some petrol stations making a loss, we see evidence that some petrol stations might take an extra day and in that day they have additional profits depending on when they bought their supply.

The answer is the CCPC does not feel there has been a situation where the international markets have changed and fuels coming in through the port have not reduced quickly enough. Is that what Mr. McHugh is saying? I am not talking about retailers because I believe the large majority are looking after the people in their areas and they also provide a service. The ones not attached to the bigger companies are looking after their people. When prices internationally change, do they come down quickly enough?

On the supply chain, there is a north-western European market in terms of where people physically go-----

I just want a yes or no. I am sorry-----

Yes.

Mr. McHugh is happy to say that. We will go away from fuel because everyone else is going to be talking about fuel. The CCPC has to look at Ireland Inc. as a whole and see where competition is. Where we do not have competition, the CCPC brings it to the attention of the Government or the authorities for them to then look at it. We are trying to remove the cap at Dublin Airport at the moment to keep people coming into it and not stifle economic growth. Should the CCPC be looking at a counterbalance to Dublin Airport whether in the midlands or somewhere else to take away that pressure and also because it has a monopoly on the greater Dublin area and the catchment area?

I will ask Mr. Gray to comment.

If the CCPC does not, I know the Europeans will.

There is a regulator in place which regulates Dublin Airport. One of its responsibilities is to assess how competition is working in the market and how its regulations impact that. We are always strongly in a position of advocating for reforms that allow entry into markets and we have done that across various sectors which we touched on today. We would equally do that in the airport market if we thought there were significant barriers to entry which could be removed by Government policy, for example, or other action by regulatory bodies to facilitate that entry. In an Irish context, when one looks at the history of the airport market, a key consideration is there is not a huge amount of scale of customers and there is a sparse population. That dictates how many airports the country can sustain. A key barrier is commercial in that it is hard for an airport operator to make money in another part of the country. We have in recent years seen the development of Cork Airport, which has been very successful, and the number of passengers has increased significantly in that time. It is a market we keep an eye on. We would act if we thought there were significant regulatory or legislative barriers getting in the way.

I am of the opposite opinion; I think there needs to be another airport in the Dublin area to facilitate the market and not have all focus on one. That is for another day. With regard to banking, we have had so many banks leave the country. What is the CCPC's position and what has it been saying to the Government with regard to trying to attract banks? Why are they not coming in? What do we need to do to attract more banks into the country? There was an announcement yesterday of a digital bank but we do not have as many banks; we do not have the competition in that area which our consumers deserve. We pay some of the highest interest rates with regard to mortgages in Europe. What is the CCPC doing? How is it trying to influence Government to change that?

I strongly agree with the Deputy. Banking is an area we view as problematic in terms of competition. We have done a number of pieces of work. We previously did a mortgage study and identified issues in the Irish market for entry into mortgages specifically. We also more broadly made a contribution to the retail banking review and made recommendations around changes. We also worked with the Central Bank on its consumer protection code with a particular focus on switching. Generally what we want to see is entry. It is a general principle that if you want a healthy market, you need to see entry because it shakes it up both in price and quality. As well as improving the switching system, we need consumers to switch. They do not switch enough in Ireland. In the big picture, having a savings and investment union and a single European market would be hugely beneficial for Irish consumers. The other point we have made publicly, have argued for and continue to think will make a difference is, when you ask banks why they do not come to Ireland, one issue is there are a lot of hoops to jump through and hurdles to jump over in regulation. One of our recommendations is the Central Bank should have a competition mandate. When it makes its multiple decisions - there is not just one - that new entrants will have to jump over, it should consider competition as part of that process. It still has its duties in safeguarding the banking system but it has in mind competition when making decisions.

Can I just come in with one quick final statement?

Very briefly.

I believe that a really good job is being done under the limitations that exist. I do not think the commission has the teeth it requires to be able to push Government in the right direction. We need to change legislation to make that happen.

I have the next slot and then we will go to Deputy Albert Dolan.

As I said at the outset of today's meeting, we have witnessed scenes in Ireland that we have not seen in my lifetime in respect of the protests and the national outrage about energy costs and ultimately the issue of the cost of living. The first part of trying to find solutions is to understand how such a huge head of steam built up on this issue. As Cathaoirleach of this committee, I try to be impartial in having Opposition and Government views here. I am also a TD for the constituency of Cork East, where the oil refinery in Whitegate operates. To be fair, the fuel report that has been put together is very informative. It was compiled for March 2026 and is very helpful in the current circumstances. I draw attention to page 12 of the report, which gives examples of some of the complaints that were received. I want to acknowledge consumers and the public while we are in committee. One from 5 March states:

I want to complain about [trader] jumping the price of diesel and other fuels. I got diesel there on Monday at €1.719 cent a litre and on Wednesday afternoon the same garage charging €1.759 a litre and no new delivery. This morning Thursday the 5/3 the price is €1.839 so that’s a jump of 12c in three days.

There are other references in the report to 24-hour periods when fuel jumped in price by more than 10 cent. The report gives a breakdown of where these complaints are coming from. There was a very high number in County Cork, with 52. County Laois stands out as well, with 40. Limerick had 34. Counties Meath, Kildare and Dublin were huge, with 58, 69 and 93, respectively. The report found very few examples - approximately 5% - where the commission felt some degree of price-gouging was going on. I ask Mr. McHugh to give further analysis of the findings, to explain, when this is broken down, what is going on behind the scenes, so people they better understand it.

I compliment the question asked by Deputy Tony McCormack. He is so right. When we see international wholesale prices decreasing, why does it take so long for consumers to see that at the pump when they are under so much pressure? Can the Oireachtas do more? Can we as a committee feed that back to Government? I am referring to companies passing on that much-needed financial relief to consumers who need to buy fuel. We think of elderly people sitting at home who need home heating oil and farmers who need green diesel. I am hearing of farmers who are paying over €450 to fill the tank of a tractor. There is €40 per acre going onto the price of silage because of these increases. I need to get some sense of reassurance that the witnesses are doing their jobs and putting on pressure for those reductions are passed on.

I will ask Mr. Gray to talk a bit more about the detailed analysis of the report. As I said, we hear from consumers every day. The pain is huge and the cost-of-living crisis is real. Like everyone else in this room, we hear from those people all the time and we do not underestimate that pain. Our report has provided hard evidence about what is happening. Unfortunately, it does not solve the pain that we see every day. We have all heard this idea that a significant part of the pain is caused by profiteering by some dodgy practices. It is important for us to provide the examples that we hear from consumers, and it can happen from day to day. However, in general, the hard evidence says that the pain people are suffering is driven by the wholesale prices. In general, prices go up and down in line with the wholesale price. I will ask Mr. Gray to speak more about how we went about arriving at that conclusion.

I will say this for the benefit of the public. We often forget that we are all very well-read on this issue. Please give a little bit more information about wholesale prices. It is important that people get a full grasp of that.

As Mr. McHugh mentioned, we looked at internationally set wholesale prices in north-western Europe. Ireland is a price taker in those markets. We saw significant increases in those prices. Between the beginning of the year and mid March the price of kerosene, which is the predominant fuel used in home heating, increased by 150%. The price of diesel had increased by 100%, and the price of petrol had increased in the same period by 70%, all on the wholesale markets. When we looked then at the retail prices we saw an increase for kerosene of 80% in the price. For petrol, depending on the metric used, we saw an increase of either 6% or 12%. For diesel we saw an increase of approximately 12% or approximately 22%. If we compare those statistics, what we actually saw was that the retailers in the motor fuel markets and home heating markets did not pass on the full extent of the wholesale cost increase to the customers. In other words, they took some of the burden themselves, on average, in the market.

As Mr. McHugh mentioned, we previously did a very detailed analysis of the excise duty cut, which was when there was a reduction in the cost in 2022. We found that, on average, the retailers did pass that through in a reasonable timeframe.

What is a reasonable timeframe?

That is a good question. I was about to say there is a point of detail, particularly in relation to motor fuels suppliers, because they all operate different models. A lot of them store wholesale fuel on their premises, and each of them has different quantities that they are able to store. The other thing is that some of them have fixed-supply agreements for their wholesale prices. That is why we tend to see the pass-through - both in terms of an increase in cost and in terms of a reduction in cost - not being fully passed through to consumers immediately. In contrast, in the home heating oil market, they are much more reliant on a short-term basis and they tend to pass on cost increases and decreases quite quickly.

Thank you very much. I appreciate the information and we might get back to a second round. Next is Senator Aubrey McCarthy.

Having listened to the witnesses and looked at the opening statements one thing I have addressed recently is wasted energy. I am hearing that 550,000 households in fuel poverty while at the same time millions of euro worth of energy is being wasted. It think is something like €1.4 million per day. How can a system that seems to waste clean energy while people go cold be considered to work very well for consumers? I am chair of an organisation called Tiglin. We work with another organisation to try to heat water tanks for those who are in social housing or supported housing. It seems to work very well. Given the statutory role of the CCPC to protect consumers, do the witnesses see the failure to use surplus energy as a big issue? What role should the CCPC play in addressing the big wastage?

Can I clarify what the Senator means by wasted energy?

Energy that cannot be stored.

So wind on the system that cannot be used?

Yes.

It is a problem. As market experts we would say that the market is not functioning very well or there needs to be consideration given to how the market functions in order to allow that product, which has value, to be used. We know this area and we work quite closely with the CRU, which is the regulator in the area. It makes the decisions on how the wholesale market operates.

Something we always engage with them on is how competition might work and how you might incentivise the market. One of the big issues, and we may all be aware of it, is around how you incentivise batteries to beyond the network, so that the actual energy-----

The issue seems to be storage. There is no problem producing it-----

Yes.

-----but it is about storing that energy. In the middle of a cost-of-living crisis and what we saw last week, surely we should be examining how best to store. That should be the priority.

Absolutely. I know it is something that is regularly reviewed by the CRU. The question is not just one of storage because anyone can buy a battery and store the energy; it is what their incentive is to do so. Those batteries on the network will provide huge value, so what incentive regime should be in place to facilitate people to buy those batteries? The other key element is at the other end-----

As in grant aid?

As they provide a value to the grid, which batteries do, it is whether there should be money available for people through various mechanisms. How the wholesale electricity market works is quite a detailed structure, but it is an area of discussion where you can be incentivised to have a battery and not just have to pay for it all yourself. That does happen.

Given what we have seen in the last week - we saw a resignation yesterday - and all this about fuel and the price going up, is it not frightening that at the same time we are throwing away hundreds of millions of megawatts in wasted energy? Maybe I am a bit naive here, but if we can plug that gap and fix that, will we go a long way to fixing fuel poverty?

Absolutely. It is a focus of the broader industry. The other side of it that is very important to mention is demand. Often, what happens at night, when people are not using electricity, is there is a lot of wind, which cannot be used and we have wasted energy. How do we switch demand to night-time?

If we store it, we do not have to switch demand.

That is true. You can store it and if you have more demand when the wind is blowing, then you do not lose that energy. The whole idea of tariffs and having cheaper tariffs when the wind is blowing is that people will switch on their machines, both domestically and industrially, so that energy can be used. To go back to the market, is there enough incentive for people and businesses to use the demand when the wind is blowing?

Is there enough of an incentive from the Government to address the issue? It is like filling up a car full of petrol and then if it is not used by midnight, it is all dumped. That just does not make sense in the current state of play. Will the CCPC advocate for a change in policy in order to address this and actively do that? It would then be dealing with a current situation-----

Generally, we engage with the CRU on the electricity market. We are currently working with them. We have been asked by the Minister to do a review of retail electricity and gas. We are working with the CRU to make sure we co-ordinate what everyone does but that problem, which is an international issue because the same thing happens anywhere there are renewable-----

What is best practice internationally in that situation when too much energy is being produced?

There are two elements. One is batteries so energy can be stored, or stored in some other form, but it is becoming increasingly economical to do so with batteries. It is also about having an incentive regime so that people will buy the batteries and store the electricity. The second is moving demand to when there is wind or sun. In many countries, it is a big issue at midday. It is about moving demand to when the renewables are actually generating.

It is hard to change consumer behaviour. I can see how the CCPC is up against something difficult when it comes to moving demand but if we can store it, it does not matter about the demand. I have laboured that point, but Mr. McHugh gets it.

I do.

There is something we are missing here, and there is something huge we can work on and make a difference. I run the Lighthouse homeless cafe on Pearse Street - I have just come from there. We are dealing with people who are absolutely feeling the pinch. People are coming in who have an apartment but they cannot heat it and are coming in for their lunch. That type of thing needs to be addressed. Yet, we are throwing fuel away.

Does the way the 30 km delivery radius rule for home heating oil works create a difficulty regarding pockets of competition locally?

I will ask Mr. Gray to comment on that. I will just note that it is not a rule; it is what we see in the market. It is how the home heating oil companies naturally work. They generally go around 30 km.

It is exactly as Mr. McHugh said. When we are looking at a merger and are trying to assess whether that merger might limit competition, we need to look at a particular market where the competition takes place. We have a specific radius for home heating oil. The reason we came up with that radius is because that tends to be where the companies will deliver to. If it is beyond 30 km, it becomes less worth it for the company because of transportation costs and other issues. There are always customers on the margins who might be able to get a supplier to come closer to them. It just allows us to ensure that if there is a merger between competitors at a local level, we are not missing a potentially anti-competitive effect if we draw that circle too large.

I apologise for coming in. This is clashing with another committee. If some questions have already been asked, the witnesses can let me know.

In relation to the new legislation that is coming down the line, what does the CCPC need in terms of strengthening its powers? I would love to hear what it needs. Will the witnesses also expand on the whole area of powers? If a complaint is made, what sanctions does the CCPC give or what sanctions have ever been given? I do not need specific companies. I ask them to outline that.

There are two big things we would like to see, which are included in the consultation for the new legislation. One is the ability for us to levy administrative sanctions for breaches of consumer law. We currently have it for breaches of competition law and we would like to see it for breaches of consumer law. That is where we would make a finding that there has been a breach of the law, we would review what the appropriate sanction is relative to the harm caused by the breach of the law and we would levy the sanction, which would obviously be then appealable to court. That is what is planned and what we really need.

I will come to the other element, which is around screening for bid rigging, but the Deputy asked about the current powers we have. The two are linked in terms of why we need financial sanctions. We have really increased the number of prosecutions we have taken. The type of companies we have gone after is all in the public domain. It includes Tesco, Boots, Life Style Sports, Brown Thomas and others, but for all of those that I named, the outcome was a €1,000 contribution to charity in the District Court. There is a range of cases there and they are all different, but for us the punishment did not fit the crime. That is why we need new powers. Again, as I mentioned, it is not just so the punishment fits the crime but that there is a deterrent effect for businesses and, when they are making their decisions on the systems they put in place, that they make sure they comply with consumer law.

The second thing that we asked for and is really important is the ability to screen public procurement. There is €20 billion per annum of public procurement spend in Ireland. We fully believe there are cartels within those procurements. There is a huge number of them so we are not going to point to a particular industry, but we fully believe there are cartels. We recently had a successful jury conviction in the Central Criminal Court, which was around school bus transport. It was public procurement and taxpayers' money was at risk. We are really happy with that outcome.

However, in order to be able to find more of them, and it is a real challenge in Ireland, we would like to be able to have access to that public procurement data so we can screen it. There are various data analytics that we can provide. It is not that by doing the screening we will say, "There is a cartel", but that it is the first step in an investigation. If we want a warrant to do a raid, we would need multiple pieces of evidence, but it is one that we would be really keen to have. Other countries have it. It is effectively about that access to the data. We would not interfere in any way with procurement, which can carry on. We just want access to the data to see what is happening in those markets. If we have suspicions, we will take further steps.

Those are the two areas we have asked for. They are in the proposed legislation and we really welcome them. They will make a real difference for consumers and the economy.

A sum of €1,000 is the highest fine that has been given out to anybody.

I find that absolutely incredible. Why would that put anyone off just rolling on, doing it again and taking the hit? I would not even call it a hit.

It is important to say when we do screening of pricing, for example, we look at websites of relevant companies - very big, often international companies - and how they price and present that information to consumers. Some companies are 100% compliant. It is an IT system issue. They have the system that complies with the law. Other companies do not. Often what happens - and we will look again - is when we go after them after the conviction, they will put the IT system in place to comply with the law. It is very doable. Going back to the Deputy’s point, the question of a €1,000 contribution to charity is not a great deterrent when you are making those business decisions on how to do your IT system.

Okay. Will Mr. McHugh explain something to me? This week, we got the list of the most complaints CCPC had received in running order. I am not criticising but I am looking for an explanation on this. We are dealing with companies like Ryanair, Tesco and other big companies but No. 2 on that list was a company called Rathwood. Rathwood is literally a townland outside Tullow. It is a family business built up from the ground. Yes, there have been complaints and it is struggling and having financial issues. That is too much to discuss today. I have met Rathwood. Does Mr. McHugh think that, in putting its name forward in national media and exposing it, it needs to be put in the same bracket as the multinationals? This is a small family company that is struggling. It is a huge employer in a townland. I did not feel comfortable about it. I am not going to defend what is going on and I understand but it was a headline grabber.

Yes, it was. We publish our helpline report every year. We name all the companies, whoever they are. The reason we do so is consumer complaints are absolutely key to what we do. We have talked about fuel. We have received a significant increase in complaints in relation to Rathwood. There are obviously other companies on the list. We prosecuted it previously. That is in the public domain. While I am happy to talk about where we can be harder or tougher, where we find breaches of the law, we do not care what your name is: we will look at the harm you are causing and make a decision, as we do with all companies, and if we think it is appropriate, we will go after you because that is our job. We are neutral. Whether you are Ryanair – we have spent a lot of time in court over the last year – Rathwood or anybody else, like a small car dealer who is selling a car that has been crashed to a consumer, we will go after you based on the harm that you have caused to consumers. That is our job and that is what we will continue to do.

As I say, I am not criticising but does Mr. McHugh think it is fair putting them in the same bracket? I know there have been complaints. I do not know where it is going to end up or whatever but there is a far bigger chance of a company like that collapsing than multinationals that are going to get a slap on the wrist of €1,000 or whatever. With the damage being done to that company now, I am not sure it will ever recover from it. It is a bigger thing because, as I say, it plays a huge part in the social fabric of that little area in County Wicklow.

We do understand. We understand the role that businesses have but, again, this is something that has been building for some time. In relation to what happened this week with the helpline report, it is an issue that has been going on for some time. There is a connection between the real issues in the company and the question of whether it is compliant with consumer law. We have set that out and published its name, alongside many others'. One follows the other. The helpline report follows on the issues, not the other way around. I do not say we remain blind. Rather, we will follow the evidence where we see breaches of consumer law.

I thank Mr. McHugh.

I thank all the witnesses from the CCPC for being with us today and all their ongoing work. I know it must have been a very busy time for them. There has been a spotlight on its work in the last few weeks and media attention around the role it plays, including the pivotal role of giving confidence as an independent body trying to ensure the best outcomes for our consumers and that everyone is playing fair.

Mr. McHugh made a really interesting comment about €20 billion of public procurement. I have a huge passion for public procurement. Where did Mr. McHugh get the figure of €20 billion?

It is from our engagement with the Office of Government Procurement, OGP.

The reason I ask is because I have asked a series of parliamentary questions on this over the past year. I got the figure €18.5 billion for 2025 but my fear was that was only an estimate. Nobody in the State seems to be able to tell me exactly how much was spent on public procurement in any given year. That is very concerning and I wanted to highlight that because Mr. McHugh mentioned a €20 billion figure and he said it with confidence - I have no issue with that – but the problem is the State itself cannot track how much money it has spent on public procurement because that is an estimate of tender values accumulated. It does not actually account for how much the contracts are worth. I think a huge body of work needs to be done on that. That is something I am working on.

Following on from that, Mr. McHugh made a statement that he does think cartels exist in public procurement. That is something that is incredibly concerning to me. I have two questions. What sectors does Mr. McHugh believe the cartels exist in? Are there any ongoing investigations by the CCPC into these suspected cartels?

We are aware from our engagement with the OGP that the question of data availability on spend is something that exercises it too. It might be an issue to be discussed as that legislation goes through the Oireachtas.

On which sectors, cartels can exist in almost any sector. If one looks internationally, one sees cartels being uncovered in multiple sectors. The one that does get discussed quite a lot internationally, and where one does see multiple cartels, is construction. The example I always go to is the Austrian cartel case where the Austrian revenue system raided a company for revenue. It found a folder that someone was trying to leave the building with. Subsequently, that folder helped to uncover a huge cartel almost across the whole Austrian construction sector. Until that accident, no one knew the whole Austrian construction sector generally was involved in a cartel. Our goal is to find cartels.

Does the CCPC have an ongoing investigation into the construction sector and how it navigates public procurement?

We will follow the evidence. In order to be able to progress a cartel investigation, you need good evidence. We do a huge amount of work in terms of the construction sector as regards public procurement to remind people of their obligations. There is also whistleblower leniency. As a result of the recent powers we were given in terms of competition, we can now run a leniency line whereby if you come forward with the evidence as a business, we can give you leniency of a lower fine or no fine. That is how the vast majority of cartels are discovered in Europe.

We have multiple investigations ongoing. We have a strong pipeline that we did not have before this legislation. I will talk about what is in the public domain and say no more. We have carried out raids in relation to the gambling sector and home alarms. There are multiple cases we have looked at. Another was the school transport case recently, which had a jury verdict that we very much welcomed. That continues within the court system so, again, I will not say a huge amount about it.

I am conscious the time goes quickly, so I will move on. Price gouging is something that has been talked about so much on all sides. I have heard about this from consumers, distributors and retailers.

It has been very topical. People want to know that the price, when it changes on the forecourt, is fair. Based on the data available to the CCPC right now, do the witnesses have any evidence that fuel retailers or distributors in Ireland are engaging in price-gouging or taking excessive margins during this period of turmoil?

No.

Okay. Can the CCPC outline what has happened to margins at a wholesale and retail level over the past number of weeks and whether those margins have increased beyond normal levels?

I will ask Mr. Gray to answer this one.

We did not do a detailed review of margins because that would have taken approximately eight months. That was the analysis that we did in 2022. What I can say is that the margins in the motor fuel and home heating fuel sectors remained at approximately 2% to 4% in the past three years. Our analysis of the wholesale costs which those retailers were bearing and the retail prices that they eventually charged showed that they did not pass on the full extent of those wholesale price increases, on average, and that would mean that we would be very surprised to learn that there was a significant increase in their margins in the early part of March.

A big concern that is raised with me is the speed at which the price got passed through to consumers after the commencement of the war. What got people angry is the speed at which the price went up at the pumps given that this happened 10,000 km away, a lot of the ships had already left and we are still waiting for ships to come from that part of the world. When global oil prices rise or fall, how quickly should that feed through to Irish pump prices? Is the CCPC satisfied that reductions are being passed on to consumers as quickly as increases?

It is probably important to look at the motor fuel and home heating fuel markets separately. Home heating oil producers tend to work off the day's wholesale prices. They do not store a huge amount of fuel so they are very exposed to changes in wholesale prices. We would expect both increases and decreases to be passed on relatively quickly in those markets. Indeed, the evidence in relation to home heating oil indicated that the prices were increased very rapidly.

On the motor fuel market, it is a slightly different picture because the fuel operators all operate slightly different models. They have different levels of storage of the fuel and some of them have different agreements in terms of fixed wholesale prices for a certain period of time. Therefore, we would expect both increases and decreases in costs of wholesale product to be passed on slightly slower in the motor fuels market. That is what we have seen over the past month and in the course of our analysis in early March.

I thank the CCPC for all the work it is doing. It is probably not a simple time but the public need to know that there is an organisation such as the CCPC that is a fair broker and can basically hold all retailers to account. It gives people confidence. That is the main thing. I thank them so much.

I thank Deputy Dolan. Before we proceed, I have a supplementary question. Out of interest to the committee overall, does the CCPC analyse the flow of people who work in procurement for Government and then go to work for big four companies in the private sector or other specialists that may be applying for Government contracts? Particularly for health contracts, education builds, etc., one can think of lots of examples of capital projects that might exceed €100 million or access-to-service contracts that would be in the hundreds of millions of euro.

No, we do not.

That does not necessarily make a lot of sense to me. I want to flag that transition of expertise. I do not have the right to tell anybody what they can and cannot do, but I see a serious conflict of interest there. It would be interesting to get that data. Perhaps it is something for consideration after today's meeting. I call Deputy Clendennen of Fine Gael.

I thank the CCPC for joining us here today. I want to recognise the CCPC's work. I met its representatives the week before the conflict in the Middle East kicked off, when we discussed protecting customers, trying to avoid price-gouging and ensuring there was an equal playing field in the market. It was apt, given what happened in the following days.

To pick up on Deputy Dolan's point, there was serious frustration among the public in relation to the pricing on forecourts going up and down. To be fundamentally clear and conclusive, at this point in time is any part of the supply chain in Ireland profiteering or going beyond what margins may have been previously?

I thank Deputy Clendennen for his question. We have not seen any evidence along the supply chain of significant problems with the market or significant profiteering.

It is worth saying that we have intervened in multiple layers of the market, including at the terminal. We required divestments a few years ago to make sure there was competition at the terminals, which is very important.

In the CCPC's fuels report, it did not cover every fuel, which I found slightly alarming. One forecourt fuel was not included, and that is hyrdotreated vegetable oil, HVO. HVO is a renewable fuel. It should not be rising and falling in line or in lockstep with diesel, and yet it is. Why did the CCPC not investigate HVO?

That is a reasonable question. We have had a lot of experience with kerosene, petrol and diesel. A huge amount of data is out there in terms of the question we were trying to answer between the wholesale and the retail, but it is a reasonable question to ask about HVO.

In recent weeks, we have conducted a case of submissions. This is the first report that has happened since the close of public consultation about giving the CCPC more powers. This is a critical time for fuel in Ireland but the CCPC omitted one of the fuels.

I would accept that as something we would take away and consider.

We are looking at an investment of €20 million. We are looking at trying to protect customers. This has not been comprehensive. If the CCPC is to do a job properly, there needs to be confidence across businesses and consumers. Is that a fair point?

I will ask Mr. Gray to comment.

I thank the Deputy for the question. It is a reasonable point. I would say that one of the things we did was to follow the complaints. The majority of the complaints we received about fuel were in relation to home-----

I do not buy that. If the CCPC is to do a fuel report, it should be done on the entire market and every product available in the market. That is my personal view.

The rationale for the report was strongly linked to the number of customer complaints which we received.

I ask that the CCPC look at HVO and ask why a renewable fuel is in lockstep with diesel, as a fossil fuel, and why the prices are going up and down and fluctuating in that regard.

In relation to the CCPC's reports on the barriers to entry on businesses, it recognises that smaller businesses are impacted by finance and regulation. If the CCPC saw what happened in the country in the past seven days, there is a serious concern around the cost of doing business. Regulation has a major part to play in that. How does Mr. McHugh see the CCPC's role in the time ahead in identifying regulation and over-compliance in every step of business? For example, I had a pharmacist on to me the other day about the fact that they have to have a fax - in 2026 - and a subscription to a fax is €35 a month. That is a waste of money. We need to start getting lighter, similar and faster. The CCPC has a role to play in it, but how is it going to do that?

We agree that all regulations should be continuously reviewed to make sure that they are efficient and necessary.

In terms of the barriers that we identified in the report, the areas that we are active in are: finance and banking, which is important to all small industries, and how we can go about getting more entry into that; the legal system, which also affects all small industries, directly or indirectly; and insurance, and how that can be made work better for all businesses and for consumers. Those are areas that we are active in.

From our point of view, and we touched on it in the opening statement, we are aware of our role in mergers and the impact that has on businesses.

We have been active in proposing an increase in those thresholds. We welcome the recent consultation on increasing the thresholds and somewhat reducing the regulatory burden on businesses. While we are generally supportive of a reduction in regulation it is not our role to go about reviewing Government regulations to see which ones are-----

In the context of its remit of protecting customers and having a level playing field for businesses, this is a body of work I would ask the CCPC to carry out. There is real concern among businesses and we have had witnesses before the committee speak about €5 million turnovers that could be in trouble. In villages and towns, there are small businesses that have a weekly turnover of €5,000, €10,000 or €15,000 whose viability is in serious question. The market conditions and the trading environment are not working for them. I put this down to a lot of regulation and compliance that is simply unaffordable. The CCPC has got to do work in this area to try to support those businesses. It must also come back here with examples of how we can deal with this matter.

We are in the biggest fuel crisis that has been seen in some time. The Government has committed €750 million. This week I have seen examples on my desk of where a bug in the system of an electricity supply utility company is leading to customers receiving bills that are two, three or four times what they should be, customers on out-of-contract rates when they should be getting in-contract rates and customers who have moved to another electricity provider being sent bills. When I went on its website today, I saw that it has a Swiss telephone number. Even though it is an Irish company based in Ireland, its website lists the Swiss country code. What kind of regular monitoring is the CCPC doing in this area? How does it engage with the CRU? At a time when people are up to their necks with demands coming at them, they are seeing direct debits going out from their accounts which they will have to engage on. I could not get through to the customer helpline when I tried today. We are now in a situation where people are already at their limit, and this money is going out of their accounts in the form of direct debits. I ask the CCPC to investigate this and to work with the CRU on it. There has to be a serious look at where direct debits are wrongly taken. There should be a penalty if they are not returned to customers within a certain window.

We receive very similar complaints about the energy sector in terms of consumer frustration. This is something specifically in the energy sector on which we work with the CRU and engage with it because of its role and the mandate on complaints we specifically pass on to it in order to ensure they are addressed. In the energy sector, there are quite high levels of consumer protection. There are high levels of requirement on companies in that sector, including a licensing regime with specific requirements. Where we see something like this, and we may have all seen issues with metering recently which was broader than one company and real consumer issues about incorrect billing which are very frustrating and worrying for consumers, we are happy to engage with the CRU specifically on it.

Deputy Clendennen will have seen in our helpline report the issue of and questions about the quality of some businesses' customer service. That is a real issue for us. It will remain a priority for us to address it directly and to consider how we can create a set of circumstances whereby businesses are incentivised to provide stronger and better consumer services.

t do not think they should be incentivised; they should be penalised.

The incentive would be that if they do not do it, there is some form of penalty out there.

And compensation for the consumer.

Yes. Specifically in the energy sector, those levels of protection and additional requirements are in place.

Mr. McHugh earlier made reference to the fact that the CCPC received no additional funding in the budget. It is not that normal to hear this from organisations that come before us. Does the CCPC have the resources it needs to tackle head-on the problems that have been raised with it here? This is no joke when we look at what the Leas-Chathaoirleach spoke about earlier. The CCPC deals with some of the largest companies and the top ten named companies. Rathwood was mentioned as a small local company, but there are also the likes of Ryanair, Currys, Sky, Eir, Harvey Norman, Aer Lingus, Virgin Media and Vodafone. These are very sizeable companies that have huge numbers of employees and resources. It is David versus Goliath. Will Mr. McHugh give me a little bit of information on this?

Generally, we have received a significant increase in functions in recent years. This puts a large stress on the organisation. We have also received increases in resources. In 2026, we did not receive significant resources. That is putting stress on the organisation in a number of ways. One is dealing with the new functions. We have new functions relating to data regulation, digital regulation, AI, market surveillance and new requirements. Putting systems, people, teams and structures in place to be able to run our new functions is difficult and does create risk.

The Cathaoirleach has mentioned some companies, some of which we spend a huge amount of time in court with. It is their right but it takes a lot of resources from us as an enforcement body. Other agencies similar to us have the same experience. If we want to go after these big companies we need to be prepared and to be resourced to do so. We do that - it is our job and we are very motivated to do it - but our ability to take on multiple cases across our multiple functions is limited.

It is concerning to hear that. It is helpful for our future engagement with the Department of Enterprise, Tourism and Employment when we might raise it, given the severity of the public anger out there at present, which is unlike anything I have seen. I am only 28, but I have been an elected representative for seven years between the local authority and Dáil Éireann. In addition, I worked here for three years in another capacity. People are furious, and I am very concerned. The public trust about issues we have discussed, including fuel prices, has been completely corroded. We have a job to do and a responsibility to try to reassure people that agencies such as the CCPC are performing to the extent that they can and they should be able to fulfil their functions.

The general scheme of the data Bill assigns several functions to the commission as a competent authority and data controller for the purposes of the European Data Act. Does the commission have any concern about how these new functions will operate in practice and how they might affect the operation of the commission as a whole?

We are working on setting up the teams for our data functions. Understanding exactly what the functions in the legislation are and how they will work is ongoing. I will ask Ms Ryan to speak about what is involved in these functions because it is quite interesting. It is an area where we have been given an additional function. It is potentially quite broad. It includes enforcement powers and some key issues for businesses and consumers. There is a stress on our organisation in terms of our ability to take on this function and be able to deliver it over time. We do engage closely with the Department so there are ongoing discussions on this. As decisions on the next budget are made, which is not that far away as the discussions go through, we ask that the resources are provided. I will ask Ms Ryan to speak about what we are responsible for in terms of data.

We will be the data co-ordinator and competent authority under the EU Data Act. It is an interesting regulation when we look at competitiveness. Its intention is to open up access to data and data markets to the people who use products through the Internet of things, and for businesses to provide new and innovative services arising from this opening up of data markets. Our role will be specifically in respect of the Internet of things and user rights, be they related to citizens or businesses, unfair contractual terms and the enforcement of breaches of this legislation. It is a very interesting regulation and, in the debate on whether regulation and innovation can work hand in hand, this is about opening up markets, which is something the CCPC is always supportive of. In order to be able to do this, we have functions on data literacy.

We will have to prioritise the resources we have to achieve the best outcomes we can for consumers and businesses, be that through taking cases or through getting out there and engaging with industry, consumers and users. We have many plans for what we can do. It is about how we can be resourced to fulfil these requirements. It is also fair to say that in our engagement with the Department during the budgetary process for 2026, decisions had not been made about all of the responsibilities that the CCPC would have. We have specific responsibility for emergency situations and access to data from private businesses to Government bodies. This is a new area we have had assigned to us since the budgetary negotiations and processes. How we square this circle is part of our engagement with the Department. It is legislation we are excited to implement and be responsible for. It will be about how we can best achieve it with the resources available.

We have seen an acceleration recently in job losses in respect of AI and efficiencies being made. Not too far from Leinster House, a major Irish company has listed its efficiency programme to reduce staff numbers. It is a concern and it is something we will have to do an awful lot more work on after the summer.

Before we proceed with our next speaker we will take a quick break for the use of the toilet facilities.

I thank the Chair for enabling me to go to Taoiseach's Questions. I was online earlier and I commend the work the commission does. The role it plays has never been more important, given the cost-of-living crisis, geopolitical turbulence, innovation in AI, sharing of information and all of that. The CCPC plays a critical role in the protection of our citizens and that is reflected in the number of complaints it receives. To process 1,000 complaints, as was said, just to do with fuel takes a lot of administration and resources. Has the CCPC requests in relation to the 2027 budget so that it can recruit the necessary staff and resources it needs to be able to fulfil its aims and objectives for the next year?

My other question is specifically on doorbell data, if you like. Who owns the data and how can that be shared?

There is another thing I wanted to ask about. I was in a shop on Grafton Street the other day and I could not buy the item I wanted to without putting my email address into the machine because more and more now we have situations where there are no staff and you just have to deal with machines. It would not let me purchase the item without putting in my email address, which I did not want to do. Is that legal?

I thank the Deputy very much. I will take the first question, ask Ms Ryan to talk about the second and I will try to answer the third question as well.

On our budgetary situation, we have strategic workforce planning where we set out our view on our needs, especially regarding the new functions we have and the work we are asked to do. We have detailed asks and we do engage, and will be engaging, with the Department. There are a number of roles we will look for. One of the key principles we find frustrating is senior roles. While we have received a significant increase in resources over the last number of years, we have not received a significant increase in senior roles. That creates real pressure within the organisation, so it is a specific thing we are talking about with the Department and a decision we want to see in 2026. It will take some time to do the recruitment, etc., but when we sit opposite Ryanair, CRH, Ticketmaster, Temu or Shein, we are sitting across from seven or eight people who are very highly paid and expert in their area, and while we love that world, you need people who can take them on and deliver results for consumers. As well as the budgetary number, that approval of senior roles is really important for us. Our engagement with the Department is pretty good even though we found the 2026 budget decision frustrating. Discussions are ongoing and we are hopeful we will see real movement soon in terms of our 2027 budget.

I ask Ms Ryan to respond on the doorbell issue. It is always really good to have examples, namely, scenarios that show people what the data Bill will mean for them.

I thank the Deputy for her question. One everyday item people can really identify is a smartwatch and the information generated by it. With the data Bill coming into play, you can request any data that is user-generated by you as a consumer from the company for yourself, but you could also request it be delivered to a third party. As for how that might be used, you could give information to your GP about your heart rate over 48 hours or if you were part of a clinical trial or study that information could be provided to the research organisation. The other really interesting element of this is businesses will be able to come up with new products and services, not necessarily in competition with the provider of the service or product generating the data, but to provide new services or products with the information. It is really an opening-up of the data economy whereby, say, the data that was held by manufacturers or service providers is now being made available to users and also third parties at the user's request. We hope it will be a game-changer.

Another part of the work we are doing on data regulation is the EU's Data Governance Act. This is about trust in the system and having trusted actors at EU level who will be acting under an EU logo whereby people can make sure that they can use the data they are going to get from these service providers and altruistic organisations with the confidence that they are doing so in line with GDPR and other requirements. It is building up this data economy we hope will lead to new products, new services and new insights for people as they go about their daily lives.

I have a question on that regarding congruence of data North and South, especially with the development of the all-island health service where data can be shared. What problems will sharing data across jurisdictions, particularly with the North and Britain being out of the EU, give rise to? What do we need to be doing now legislation-wise in both jurisdictions so that we have a marrying-up of the data and no barriers that would prevent us from having an all-island health service, even in relation to clinical trials, which Ms Ryan mentioned, and other things like that?

Perhaps I can answer that question in relation to user consent because what the data Act allows for is consenting to give that data to a third party. That data can be from inside or outside the jurisdiction as long as the product is put on the market in the EU and the user is willing to give that information to a third party. I would not necessarily see it as a blockage but there is a lot more in the Deputy's question.

It would not have been a problem before Brexit but will there be an additional problem now with the North being outside the EU? That is until, obviously, such time as we have reunification. I know the officials cannot comment on that, but do they see what I am saying? One of the biggest challenges we have is congruence of data overall but especially in terms of medical records that would be shared across jurisdictions.

An important distinction here is that the data Act only relates to non-personal data and we will be working very closely with our colleagues in the Data Protection Commission when personal data comes into play and where we have mixed datasets. What the Deputy might be referring to here is a mixed dataset where there is a lot of personal information and there are a lot more considerations that would have to come into play, so I cannot give her a straightforward answer on that one, I am afraid.

As part of the CCPC's role, does it have engagement with similar bodies in the North?

Unfortunately, Brexit has caused lots of problems, so in terms of information sharing, what we could previously do with the UK as a competition and consumer body we can no longer do. What we currently do with our European colleagues we just cannot do to the same extent with the UK, especially with confidential information.

Maybe it is something to think about, including what would need to happen so that we could at least start a process to be able to get rid of any barriers there.

What about the email being required to buy the item?

I will give a very quick answer and, as always, it is almost case-specific. Consumer law is about providing really clear information to the consumer before they make a decision. Generally, it tends not to have a black-and-white prevention of a certain approach by a shop on Grafton Street, for example, even though it seems like a strange step. As long as the retailer sets out very clearly what it requires from consumers, it is not normally a breach of consumer law.

I did not know until I had the item in my hand and then I could not leave it behind me. I thank Mr. McHugh.

Before we conclude, I sincerely thank the committee's previous researcher, Éanna, who has gone on to work in the European affairs unit for Ireland's upcoming Presidency of the European Union. I also want to acknowledge Nóra. It is her first meeting and she is joining us here in the committee, along with our clerk, Leo. I wish her well and we look forward as a committee to working with her in the coming months and years.

Before we adjourn, I thank our witnesses for a very informative and timely discussion given the circumstances facing the country at this time. It has been a very robust discussion. I think each side has learned from the other side's contributions today. We will adjourn until Tuesday, 21 April at 2 p.m., when we will meet in virtual private session. I note the earlier start time as we are scheduled for the meeting of the grand committee of the EU committee of the parliament of Finland. On Wednesday, 22 April at 12.30 p.m., the committee will meet again in public session. We hope to issue an invitation to Progress Ireland on that occasion or other witnesses who may be available.