I call for a debate on the issue of political reform. In the same way, I am keen to see a debate on the other referendum because it is totally premature also. I am well aware of the backlog in the Supreme Court but to think of setting up an appeal court without first tackling the antiquated hours the court system works makes no sense. There are well paid people at all levels, including the Judiciary. They should be putting in a much greater stint for the taxpayers' money they are receiving. We also have a situation where legal costs mean that only the elite of the country are in a position to access the courts. These are the priorities and they should have been attacked. Only then, by all means, if there are structural issues to be dealt with, let us deal with them.

The Senator is over time.

I ask the Leader for a substantial debate on political reform. The stranglehold on these Houses that not just the Government but also the gang of four has really worries me.

The Senator has gone way over time.

In this regard, the Cathaoirleach, the Leader and those in this House who hold office should come behind the Ceann Comhairle in his campaign to assert the independence of these Houses.

The Senator has gone way over time.

If Members fail in that regard, no meaningful effective reform will take place under this Administration and regime. Such reform is absolutely essential if democracy in Ireland is to be as robust as one would wish.