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Seanad
‹ Order of Business

Health crisis and broader policy debate

Summary

The Leader thanks Members and responds at length to the Hewlett Packard redundancies, the health crisis, waiting lists, Tesco labour issues, immigration, injection centres, Catalonia and Irish unity, and broadband. The exchange becomes a prolonged partisan argument with repeated interruptions, but the Leader also reassures Members on several requested debates and says the State must balance jobs, investment and spending.

I thank the 15 Senators who raised matters on the Order of Business. I join Senators Catherine Ardagh, Aidan Davitt and Diarmuid Wilson in offering solidarity and our thoughts to the men and women employed at Hewlett Packard in Leixlip who have this morning heard the appalling, tragic news of job losses. It is most disappointing and words will be of little solace to those who work there. I hope the arms of State will work to assist them in re-engaging in the workforce as quickly as possible. I have heard the contributions of some Senators, but this has nothing to do with Brexit or the policies of President Trump; rather, it is about the company restructuring its policy globally. There are other Hewlett Packard entities in Galway and Cork and it is important to stand with the workers today. The Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor, has engaged with the company. As Senator Diarmuid Wilson said, this is not just about the plant in Leixlip where 10,000 people are employed, although it is a pivotal flagship for IDA Ireland. It is important, however, that we engage proactively with the men and women who work there to assist them in every possible manner.

Senator Catherine Ardagh referred to the national children's hospital. As a former Chairman of the health committee who was on the St. James's Hospital site with Senator Colm Burke and others, I played a role in ensuring the project would be prioritised. The contract has been awarded to BAM and is worth €3 billion. The comment of the chief executive of the HSE was made at a private meeting of the health committee, although, in my opinion, he should not have made it because it has muddied the water. I share Senator Catherine Ardagh's concern and join her in asking for the position to be clarified. I ask her not to push the matter to a vote because the Minister for Health who is prepared to brief her and any other Member of the House personally has to make a business case to the Government which is committed to this flagship project. The contract has been approved by the HSE directorate. The priority of the Government is to ensure the project is built. The discussion has moved on from considering the different sites proposed. We have a site and there is a contract and the Minister has to make a business case to the Cabinet in order that the project can begin. As we are all united on the need for a national children's hospital, I appeal to the Senator to allow what I have outlined to happen, rather than divide the House.

Senators Rose Conway-Walsh, Colm Burke, Pádraig Mac Lochlainn, Aidan Davitt and Diarmuid Wilson touched on the importance of the health service to us as a nation. Leaving aside the harrowing distress outlined on the RTE programme, in 2017 the Department of Health will have funding of €14.1 billion to meet current expenditure and €454 million to meet capital expenditure. Going by the economics and mathematics of Senator Rose Conway-Walsh which are of a higher standard than mine, these figures represent an increase of €977 million on the budget for 2015, or an increase of 7.4% on the original voted budget and 3.5% on the final projected outturn. I agree wholeheartedly with Senator Diarmuid Wilson that if the voodoo economics of Senator Rose Conway-Walsh's party in the North were to be transferred to the South, there would be bedlam. We would have tractors on Grafton Street.

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Its Members can come into the House and spout their great theories, but it is a high tax and high spend party.

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Can the Leader explain why so many people are in pain?

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The Senator is not interested in the answer.

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I am really interested in it.

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The Senator is never interested in it.

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Denis O'Donovan An Cathaoirleach Fianna Fáil

I ask the Leader and the Senators who are interjecting to, please, respect the Chair.

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This is a never-ending lecture.

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Senator Rose Conway-Walsh is never interested in knowing the real facts. Her party wants to tax people and spend its way out of everything.

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We learned the real facts on Wednesday night.

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There is an election in the North and some day it will be found out up there also. Its policies have done nothing to help communities in the North.

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How many Fine Gael politicians stand for election in the North?

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The Government must balance the need for foreign direct investment and to create jobs. Senator Colm Burke is right: when we took over in government, 15% of citizens were unemployed; today the figure is 7.1%. That means more men and women are at work, contributing to the State in order that more can be spent on health services. There is an extra €2.6 billion for capital infrastructure, but Senator Rose Conway-Walsh's party wants to tax people and spend, while forgetting about the borrowing constraints and the need to save for a rainy day. It cannot be done. They are not adolescents at home who are depending on mummy and daddy for pocket money. The State has an obligation to spend and provide for its citizens. That is what we will do.

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It also has a responsibility not to leave hundreds of thousands of people in pain, which is what the Government is doing.

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This and the last Government rescued the people-----

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That is why they are in America and Britain.

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-----with no thanks due to Sinn Féin which both here and in the Dáil opposes everything every day.

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It has not rescued people who are in pain and waiting for treatment.

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One cannot have it both ways.

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The Leader cannot have it both ways. If he was not full of admiration for himself-----

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The Senator's party has discovered in government in the North that it cannot do everything. The proof lies in the economy. Farmers will receive no payments from the European Union.

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The Government is withholding GLAS payments.

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It is also reflected in hospitals and the education system. Schools and police stations have been closed, while the health system is in rag order.

Senator Maria Byrne referred to the subject of mindfulness. I will be happy to have the Minister for Health come to the House to discuss it. The Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Helen McEntee, was here last week to speak about it.

Senator Mark Daly referred to the importance of the poultry industry. While I did not see the programme last night, I will be happy for the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Michael Creed, to come to the House to discuss the issue. It could also be the subject of a Commencement matter. As it is linked with Brexit, it is important to debate it.

Senator Paul Gavan mentioned Tesco. During the week I received a response from Ms Christine Heffernan. I am not sure if the Senator received one, but I will be happy to send him a copy of it. She said there had been no change to the contracts and that Tesco and the unions were in discussions. She also said Tesco was happy to engage with the mechanisms of the State.

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That is not true.

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I will forward a copy of the e-mail after the Order of Business. I share the Senator's view that there is an obligation on Tesco, as an employer, to treat its workers fairly and with respect. That means combining pay and conditions together because, in some cases, workers are on or just above the national minimum wage and require protection. If what the Senator says is true, it is not good enough.

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There is a mandate to ballot.

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I appreciate that, but it is important to note that there are mechanisms of the State that could and should be used by all sides in that regard.

Senator Michelle Mulherin raised the issue of immigration. While we have discussed it, I will be happy to have the Minister responsible come to the House to discuss it again.

Senators Aodhán Ó Ríordáin and Frank Feighan thanked the Minister of State, Deputy Catherine Byrne, and complimented her on the initiative to establish injection centres. It is important to credit the Minister of State for being able to pursue and have the legislation approved. As Senator Aodhán Ó Ríordáin said, it will help to save lives.

Senator Grace O'Sullivan raised the issue to be debated during Private Members' business. All I can say as Leader of the House is that the Government has engaged with the Senator and is willing to engage further with her on it. It is one for the Minister to discuss in the House today.

Senator Ó Clochartaigh, tá díomá orm freisin faoin ráiteas a rinne an Príomhaire, Arlene Foster. Tá an-tacaíocht ag an Rialtas dár dteanga dúchais. As I said yesterday in response to Senators Lorraine Clifford-Lee and Mark Daly, I agree that the decision made by the DUP on the Irish language and the Irish language Act was very short-sighted. One day they said "No" but the following day they found the money for Irish summer schools and to implement the Irish language Act. It is important that, as a state, we continue to support and promote the use of our language under the Good Friday Agreement in both the North and the South. It is the first language of the State and I hope that, as part of the ongoing Brexit negotiations, post-Brexit and following the elections in the North, those who want to speak the Irish language will be supported in any manner or form. I stand with Senator Trevor Ó Clochartaigh in that regard.

I am not going to get involved in the dispute or issue of a Catalan referendum on independence. Anybody has a right to express a viewpoint, whether he or she is a parliamentarian or a citizen. That is what we cherish in a democracy. Certainly, I would not support the imprisonment or reprimand in any shape or form of anybody for expressing a view or protesting about it within the laws of the land.

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Will they keep denying Catalonia independence also?

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And Irish independence.

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The issue of the unity of the country is not the preserve of Sinn Féin.

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It is the preserve of all of us. If one goes back to the Good Friday Agreement, it is about consent and all of us working together if we share that viewpoint, as I do. As such, it is not the preserve of Sinn Féin but about all of us having that aspiration.

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I never said it was not.

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I am just making the point. Every day Sinn Féin Senators mention a 32-county Ireland. Every political party is in favour of that principle. How we get there is what we must work on. It is important to make the point that it is not just the preserve of Sinn Féin.

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We absolutely welcome that statement.

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We do not need to be patronised.

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Denis O'Donovan An Cathaoirleach Fianna Fáil

I ask Members to, please, respect the Chair.

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We look forward to the Government putting pressure on the British Government to open the legacy files.

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Denis O'Donovan An Cathaoirleach Fianna Fáil

Please allow the Leader to conclude.

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I have every confidence in the Taoiseach who is leading the negotiations for us on Brexit. He has done a very good job in the six years since he took office.

Senator Pádraig Mac Lochlainn raised the issue of broadband. I will be happy to have the Minister for Communications, Climate Action and Environment, Deputy Denis Naughten, come to the House to discuss it because the Senator is right that the roll-out of broadband is central to the development of rural Ireland to 2040 and as a counter to Dublin and urban areas. We need to expedite the provision of broadband in rural areas.

Senator Rónán Mullen raised the very important issue of prison services and referred to the remarks of Mr. Michael Donnellan on myriad issues. I will be happy to have the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Frances Fitzgerald, and perhaps the Minister of State at her Department, Deputy David Stanton, come to the House to discuss them.

I mentioned Senator Diarmuid Wilson when I discussed health issues.

I ask Senator Catherine Ardagh not to divide the House but to allow me to get the Minister for Health to brief her. I have asked him to come to the House to discuss the matter.

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