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Seanad
‹ An tOrd Gnó - Order of Business

Pay transparency Bill

Summary

Senator Ardagh proposes moving No. 18 before No. 1 and explains the Remuneration Information and Pay Transparency Bill. Senator Crowe secondes and outlines the Bill’s aims to publish salary scales and curb pay secrecy; the Leader accepts the amendment and it is agreed.

I congratulate the Cathaoirleach and our new Leader on their new terms. I wish them both very well.

I am delighted, with my colleague, Senator Crowe, to introduce the Remuneration Information and Pay Transparency Bill. I would like No. 18 to be taken before No. 1.

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Jerry Buttimer An Cathaoirleach Fine Gael

Are you proposing an amendment to the Order of Business, Senator?

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Yes, I propose that No. 18 be taken before No. 1. The Bill obliges employers with more than 50 employees to publish the salary scales of the job positions they have on offer. There will be some form of redress in the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC, using the current employment infrastructure. The Bill will also prohibit employers from asking potential employees about their salary histories. I am delighted to introduce the Bill. My colleague, Senator Crowe, will second the proposal.

I also wish to mention what many Senators have stated today. Senator Seery Kearney, who has left the Chamber, and I went to the Drimnagh for All United Against Racism rally on Saturday. It might be an idea to have a debate in the House on this matter because people are conflating the issues of homelessness and the refugee crisis. A big war is happening. It is not being called the third world war but it is the biggest war on our doorstep as a member of the EU. The war is still ongoing in many parts, and people are fleeing here for refuge and a safe haven. I am delighted we are giving them those. There are people driven by fear and hate, and those driven by hate are wrongly getting the support of those who are perhaps driven by fear. Perhaps the Seanad could lead on this because it is a conversation happening in every household in the country. It is so easy to see black and white in this, but it is a lot more complicated than that. We should lead on it to try to ensure that we are a bit more peaceful and that we talk about it a little more.

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I thank our new Cathaoirleach. I am part of the Ballinasloe Says No committee. It is really how I got involved in being a community representative. It is a community group that challenged the inappropriate location of a waste transfer station in Ballinasloe, in low-lying floodplains. We received news this week that Galway County Council has noted that the planning permission has lapsed for the proposed site. It was inappropriate and unsuitable. This is such a win for Ballinasloe. As a community, we said "No" to hundreds of 30-tonne trucks coming through the centre of our town, the air pollution and the impact on our environment and waterways. I wish to thank a number of people. So many have been involved, but I thank my brother Brian, who started all this. There was an objection based on the outcome of a 1999 High Court order, whereby families all around fought against this dump without proper infrastructure. In December 2017, five years ago, we came together, a committee with a chair, Vincent Parsons, Eamonn O'Donoghue, Mick O'Neill and treasurers Niall Donnellan and Darragh Dolan. Our family and friends went out knocking on doors, in snow and ice, like this time of year five years ago. We knocked on every door. More than 500 people came to our public meeting on 10 January. Among our public representatives here, Senator Eugene Murphy was very supportive. Other public representatives and councillors attended. Thousands of submissions were signed as we challenged permits over the past five years in the High Court. Our amazing volunteers who had to organise fundraisers, everyone in our community, the clubs and businesses that donated - all gave of their time. There were all our musicians and artists who helped us with fundraising nights of music in our hotels, Gullane's and the Shearwater, as well as table quizzes, raffles, floats and golf classics. We did everything to raise funds. We did everything to fight this battle. I thank our legal team of solicitors and barristers. We know, as a committee, that every step, motion and action in the past five years brought us to this step.

We will review future developments in this area. I just wanted to acknowledge this incredible achievement. It has spurred an awareness of the stunning landscapes on our doorsteps. There are so many positive things about it. We have a cycleway coming to Ballinasloe. I thank each and every person involved and Members of this House for their support.

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I wish the Cathaoirleach well in his term over the coming months and years. I also wish the Leader, Senator Chambers, well. There is no better lady for the job. This afternoon, with my colleague Senator Ardagh, I will bring the Remuneration Information and Pay Transparency Bill 2023 before the House. As Senator Ardagh outlined, the purpose of the Bill is twofold. The main aim is to significantly reduce the gender pay gap. We are all familiar with that issue, which is discussed week in and week out. The Bill seeks to have salary scales and ranges published when companies advertise jobs on a consistent basis. It is important to highlight, as Senator Ardagh outlined, that employers will not be in a position to request details of current or previous salaries of applicants. This is welcome legislation and I look forward to working on it with my colleague over the coming weeks.

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This morning, the National Transport Authority, NTA, officially announced the new greater Dublin area transport strategy, which extends until 2042. This follows Cabinet approval of the document last week. One of the first projects listed by the CEO of the NTA, Anne Graham, is the Navan rail line. Having represented the town of Navan and having fought for this project for a long time, I am delighted it has eventually become part of a multibillion euro package. I pay tribute to the people of Navan, who made their voices heard in this process. Of the 4,000 submissions the NTA received on all the projects across Ireland, some 2,000 of those, or 50%, came from the people of Navan and were for this rail line. That made the NTA sit up and listen to what we had been saying for years, namely, that the fastest growing town on the eastern seaboard, Navan, was the only one without rail connectivity.

I am glad this project is firmly part of the transport strategy but I want to ensure we have a debate with the Minister for Transport on the entirety of the plan, including on the Navan rail line. This must be kept on track from a planning point of view. I have been here before with major projects such as the M3 motorway. There were many lads and lassies up trees or down rabbit holes protesting that project. There were more lads down holes along the route in Meath than we saw in Fantastic Mr. Fox and they delayed the project by a significant number of years, adding €150 million to the price. They did so for naught because the objections were flawed. I want to make sure the people of Navan, who are enthused about this news, get a swift planning process to make sure this project becomes reality.

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I am delighted to congratulate and address the Cathaoirleach, whom we called the Leader in a previous Seanad. I wish him the best. This is my first chance to do so since his elevation to high office. I also congratulate Senator Chambers on her appointment as Leader and thank Senators Mark Daly and Regina Doherty who previously held leadership positions for their work.

The following point may have been discussed already and, if so, I apologise for raising it again. I am a member of the Joint Committee on Transport and Communications on which the Cathaoirleach recently worked. I ask for a discussion on where we are with the national car test, NCT, system. I will not say the NCT is beyond repair but it is out of control. For example, the earliest appointment available in Deansgrange on the NCT system is on 4 September.

It is not exclusive to Deansgrange. It is the same all over the country. I have looked at other places. Whether it is Carrigaline, Clifden or various other parts of the country it is months and months away. I can go in at any hour of the day and look for slots and I might find one because somebody has cancelled one in April or one in May, but that is it. There are not big blocks being released at any time. We need to bring in the Minister for Transport, Deputy Eamon Ryan, to ask him what is going on. We are bringing him into the transport committee but I believe there are many more Senators than those who are members of that committee who have issues relating to the NCT. It is everyone's responsibility to be in possession of a car that is roadworthy, but it is a condition of driving that one has a valid NCT. All over the country, we have people driving who are kind of okay because while gardaí will not turn a blind eye, as long as the car looks roadworthy, they will let them off, but the reality is the system is not fit for purpose, there are enormous backlogs and we must deal with it.

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I thank all Members who contributed to the Order of Business today. Senator Kyne spoke and has mentioned Inland Fisheries Ireland on a number of occasion. You will be aware, a Chathaoirligh, about the sensitivities around that issue. I will request a debate on the issue with the relevant Minister and see if we can get it scheduled, albeit that might be a challenge.

Senator Murphy spoke about An Garda Síochána. We all concur with his remarks about the awful attacks on members of An Garda Síochána. Senator Craughwell also raised issues relating to the Garda and the Defence Forces, including retention and attracting people to the force. I will request a debate with the Minister for Justice, Deputy Harris, on An Garda Síochána, to deal with not just the issues concerning their safety and well-being but also pensions and the retention issue that is now plaguing the force, as we have already seen with the Defence Forces for the past decade.

Senator Craughwell also spoke about the ongoing debate in the other House about the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Donohoe. We will await the outcome of that debate. I do not want to get into the ins and outs of that particular issue.

Senator Pauline O'Reilly spoke about hospital emergency departments. A debate with the Minister for Health was also requested by Senators Mark Daly and Maria Byrne. The Minister for Health is in the Chamber on Thursday for statements on health and emergency department waiting times.

Senator Boylan spoke about dog welfare issues. It is disgraceful to hear the situation. I cannot understand it. I appeal to Cork County Council to remove those animals without delay. They should not be in a facility where it has already been adjudicated upon that they are not safe. Those animals should be removed. I can only assume they are still there because there is nowhere to move them to, but that is simply not good enough. Plans should be put in place immediately to find somewhere safe for those animals. I hope that the full rigours of the law come to bear on the individual concerned because we need to send a strong message about animal welfare and safety in this country. Those types of facility have no place in this country. Nobody wants to see animals coming out of such facilities. I thank the Senator for raising the matter and for providing such great detail on the floor of the House on what is happening in that situation. I am sure it is not an isolated incident. We can be damn sure there are other such facilities across the country. A message needs to go out that they will be closed down and that proper action will be taken. I object to the idea that the individual would be asked to sell those animals and make a profit from them. In my view, the company is not entitled to any profit from those animals.

Senator Sherlock spoke about the ongoing debate in both Houses and in wider society about the abuse meted out to politicians. I concur with her remark that all of us at some stage or another have been subjected to commentary that we should not have to deal with. Unfortunately, it is becoming part of the job, which is probably something we must push back against. It is welcome to see the issue being discussed and debated beyond these Houses as well. All we can do is continue talking about it and try to stop matters escalating.

Senator Sherlock also requested a debate with the new Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Deputy Coveney, on the jobs already lost in the tech sector. I believe she was referring to the tech sector and to the challenges in that space. The Tánaiste, Deputy Micheál Martin, has also spoken about that issue, in terms of the readjustment that is happening in that space. Many new jobs were created in it during the pandemic but they are not being sustained. We will request that debate at the earliest opportunity.

Senator Black spoke about the CAMHS report. We all share her concerns about the report. Senator Maria Byrne raised the issue as well. A debate is scheduled with the Minister of State, Deputy Butler, for Wednesday, 1 February on that report, and the entire area of child mental health. We will have that debate next week.

Senator Paul Daly spoke about forestry and Coillte. The issue was also raised by Senator Malcolm Byrne.

That debate has been scheduled for 14 February with the Minister, Deputy McConalogue. We will have the debate in the coming weeks.

Senator Seery Kearney spoke around the issue of surrogacy. I commend her and others in this House, including Senator Ardagh, who have worked tirelessly on the area of assisted human reproduction with regard to the challenges and very real families and people who are behind those issues, and on the need to advance that legislation. I know the Senator will liaise with the Cathaoirleach on that Commencement matter. It is a matter for him to deal with.

A number of Senators raised, in slightly different ways, the issues with regard to international protection, individuals coming into the country and Ukrainian refugees. They referred to the challenges and strain that is putting on some services and the protests. Senator Keogan raised the issue, as did Senators Flynn and Ardagh. There are many angles to the issue. We have scheduled a debate with the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, for Wednesday, 15 February, to address all of those issues. It is a lot to fit in one debate. Future debates may require scheduling but, at least, it will be a start for Members to put their views on the floor of the House. I appreciate there are different views on different parts of that issue.

Senator Malcolm Byrne seconded the request by Senator Paul Daly for a debate on Coillte, which has been scheduled. He also requested a debate with the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, on the future of the film industry. We will request that of her. The Senator also spoke about a project from the BT Young Scientist and Technology Exhibition by two students in Wexford on vaping. I concur with the Senator's remarks. It is a worrying trend and good to see the legislation is progressing. It is not surprising the tobacco companies are the same companies promoting vaping. They looked to move from one product to another and obviously have targeted children and young people. What would one expect really, other than that type of behaviour? Thankfully, our legislation is moving in that regard.

Senator McGahon has requested a debate on social welfare officers with the Minister, Deputy Humphreys. We will request that debate at the earliest opportunity.

Senator Flynn spoke on the area of refugees and the conversations and language being used. We have scheduled the debate for Wednesday, 15 February.

Senator Mark Daly asked for a debate on emergency departments, as did others. That is happening on Thursday.

Senator Maria Byrne spoke, as she often does, about Limerick hospital. That debate is scheduled for Thursday. She has also spoken about the CAMHS report. That debate is happening on 15 February.

Senator Boyhan raised the issue of thalidomide sufferers and has asked that the few remaining survivors be accommodated with regard to the compensation package. I know the Government is working hard to resolve that issue. I do not have a further update for the Senator except what is already in the public domain, but it may be worth a Commencement matter to see where the issue is at.

Senator Ardagh requested an amendment to the Order of Business, that No. 18 be taken before No. 1, which was seconded by Senator Crowe, to introduce the Remuneration Information and Pay Transparency Bill 2023. I am happy to accept the amendment to the Order of Business and I commend both Senators for bringing the Bill to the House. It is very important legislation. Companies of a sufficient size and scale should be in a position to publish full information and not try to have a race to the bottom with regard to pitting candidates off each other, which can often happen where the salary is unknown and a candidate is asked about a previous salary. Anything we can do to empower employees and people in the jobs market is a very worthwhile endeavour. I look forward to debating that legislation at the earliest opportunity.

Senator Dolan spoke about Ballinasloe, as she very often does. I think we are all very aware of everything happening in the community of Ballinasloe; good, bad and in between. I commend the Senator and others who worked on that campaign. I know it is a very proud moment for any community, when a campaign that is backed by such passion and support is successful and the community wins out. It is important to acknowledge the work done by all the team.

Senator Crowe spoke about the Bill and the need to progress legislation with regard to pay transparency and remuneration.

Senator Cassells spoke about the National Transport Authority. I commend him for many years of work on advocating for the Navan rail line. He gives those of us who are campaigning for the western rail corridor some hope that, eventually, we may get there. It is very welcome and long overdue. Navan is a huge town and commuter area. It is a very difficult place from which to commute because of the lack of public transport. It is welcome that finally, at long last, the rail line is being advanced by the Government. I commend the 2,000 citizens who took the time and made the effort to make a submission. That makes the difference and this is evidence of it. The community has won today. It is great to see that announcement coming through and I commend Senator Cassells on his long work on that issue.

A debate on rail is scheduled for Thursday, 23 February. We will debate the Navan rail line, the western rail corridor and any other rail matters the Senators wish to raise.

Senator Horkan spoke about the NCT system. It might be worth a Commencement matter to see whether we can get an update.

I know there are challenges across the country, especially for younger people who are trying to get on the road. It is a big issue in rural parts of my area, Mayo, where people are trying to get driving. It is essential for getting to work or to college. Many students commute. It is a big issue that is not being sorted. We would welcome an update on that. If the Commencement matter does not yield the information that the Senator requires, we will look to schedule a debate on it at the earliest opportunity.

Comment on this
Jerry Buttimer An Cathaoirleach Fine Gael

Seanadóir Catherine Ardagh has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 18 be taken before No. 1". It was seconded by Senator Crowe. The Leader has indicated that she is prepared to accept this amendment. Is the amendment agreed? Agreed.

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