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Dáil
‹ Questions on Promised Legislation

Donegal Garda station downgrade

Summary

Deputy Marc MacSharry raised the downgrading of Donegal town Garda station and linked it to wider rural policing concerns, triggering a prolonged row over an alleged Goebbels reference. Deputy Pearse Doherty then supported the concern and blamed past recruitment policy for reduced Garda numbers in Donegal, asking for more gardaí to keep stations open. The Minister said these operational matters were for the Garda Commissioner, and the exchange descended into repeated calls for withdrawal and apologies.

Pages 96 and 97 of the programme for Government reads: "Building a visible and familiar policing presence is vital to...deterring crime." This has been replicated all over the country, but I will raise an example of something that is happening in the Chief Whip's constituency in Donegal where a Garda station, despite being scheduled for a €2 million upgrade, which is on the never-never like so many other jobs, is going from a 24-hour station to a part-time service. That area covers Inver, Frosses, Dunkineely, Killybegs, Kilcar, Glencolmcille, Donegal town, Drimarone, Ardaghey, Barnesmore Gap, Laghy and Ballintra. This is against the backdrop of our launch of Project Ireland 2040 in Sligo, which cost €45,000. What message are we sending? It is one thing wheeling everyone down for a €45,000 Goebbels-style launch. It is another thing when in reality-----

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The Deputy should withdraw that slur.

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-----we are cutting services and-----

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That is a disgusting slur.

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Patrick O'Donovan Minister of State at the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform Fine Gael

He should withdraw it.

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If I could finish.

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Yes. Order, please.

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It was a reference to Goebbels.

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That €45,000 could have quite easily-----

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Leo Varadkar The Taoiseach Fine Gael

The Deputy is belittling the Holocaust.

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He may want to reflect on it.

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Please, Deputies.

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If I could finish.

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Can we let the Deputy finish? Then we can respond.

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As the Ceann Comhairle knows, it was a political charge and drawing an analogy with an actual event in history is fine.

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It was an anti-Semitic slur on politicians.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

It was not in order.

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The Government might not like the fact-----

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Deputy MacSharry's time is up.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

The last person to make that statement apologised to the House.

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If I could just get the same level of leniency-----

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Deputies, please.

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If I could just get the same level of leniency afforded to other Members, I would be most appreciative. The reality is that it will take an awful lot of the €1.5 million that the Government will spend on these candidate promotion events-----

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The Deputy's time is up. Thank you.

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-----in newspapers throughout the country to undo the damage and destruction the Government is doing to rural Ireland.

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Please, the Deputy's time is up.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

On a point of order, a comment like that previously was withdrawn.

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The use of this money in this way is tantamount to theft from the people.

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Your time is up.

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It is stealing taxpayers' money, and Fine Gael should refund it.

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Your own party would know about that.

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Apart from that, what is the Government's proposal for the people of south Donegal-----

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Deputy MacSharry, please resume your seat.

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-----in terms of its downgrading of their Garda station?

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He will be on Sky News again. He wants to go international.

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Will the Deputy please resume his seat?

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It was an anti-Semitic slur.

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Brendan Griffin Minister of State at the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport Fine Gael

The references to Nazis are completely and utterly out of order.

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Will the Minister of State resume his seat? I do not-----

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They are completely and utterly out of order.

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He should apologise.

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A former Minister used that name in the House a number of years ago-----

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Resume your seat.

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-----and apologised the following day. This is the second time I have heard a member of the Opposition using that name this week in reference to this Government. It is despicable.

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Deputies

Hear, hear.

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Resume your seat.

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Deputy MacSharry should apologise and withdraw it. It was anti-Semitic.

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He is just wasting time.

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The Minister for Justice and Equality will respond.

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It was a metaphor.

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You are a disgrace.

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It was an anti-Semitic slur on Holocaust survivors.

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The only people Deputy MacSharry is letting down are the members of his own party.

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It was a slur on the Holocaust.

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You are stealing the people's money.

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Will Deputy MacSharry-----

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Deputy MacSharry is in a hole. He should put down the shovel.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

It was an outrageous remark.

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Deputy Pearse Doherty, please. Is it on the same matter?

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Deputy MacSharry should apologise.

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It was an anti-Semitic remark.

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I did not say anything about that.

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It is on the same issue. I am glad to support what Deputy MacSharry said about the Garda station in Donegal town, which is going from a 24-hour service to a six-hour service. This is on the back of many Garda stations having been closed in Donegal as a result of Deputy MacSharry's party closing down the recruitment of gardaí via Templemore-----

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-----which has devastated Garda services in our county and across the country. That being said, we are where we are.

Why is this being contemplated now? Is it the fact that the Chief Whip does not have the same clout as the Minister, Deputy Ross? Is it quid pro quo, with one station getting opened in one part of the country through the sacrifice of rural Ireland? The people of rural Ireland are very annoyed at the fact that one of the few 24-7 Garda stations we have is being downgraded to six hours per day. The superintendent has told us that the Garda cannot ensure that it will be open even during those limited hours because gardaí will have to attend to call-outs. This is something that we see across County Donegal and much of rural Ireland, namely-----

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I thank the Deputy, but his time is up.

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-----a depletion of services time and again. At a time when we see record numbers of gardaí going through the training college, will the Minister ensure that the necessary number of gardaí will be provided to Donegal for us to keep our Garda stations open?

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Deputy, please.

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Of the 1,700 new gardaí of recent years-----

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Deputy, I am asking-----

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-----only 40 have made their way to Donegal.

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Deputies Pearse Doherty and MacSharry will both be well aware of the fact that these operational issues are quite rightly matters for the acting Garda Commissioner-----

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And Deputy Ross.

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-----and the leaders of An Garda Síochána. I am sure-----

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Maybe we should put questions to the acting Commissioner instead of to the Minister.

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Maybe you could stay quiet, Deputy.

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Maybe Deputy MacSharry would first like to apologise for the remark he made a while ago.

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It seems that the overexcited state of Deputy MacSharry from time to time has been noted in Sligo as well as here.

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And on Sky News. He has gone international.

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I would like to inform the Deputy-----

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Maybe the Government could take out an advertorial.

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Please, Deputy.

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-----that I had the pleasure of visiting Sligo recently.

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We know that. We saw it.

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Of all the people who were gathered on the occasion, Deputy MacSharry was noted for his absence from the announcements.

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Not for the first time either.

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I took the opportunity-----

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I was shoved down the back.

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Deputies, please.

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I was there, though.

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Fine Gael candidates were put up front.

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There was no space for us.

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Deputy-----

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A Cheann Comhairle, will there be an apology for the remark?

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Definitely not.

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He will not apologise for it.

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It was an anti-Semitic slur.

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How about an answer?

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Deputies, you are bringing the House-----

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It was anti-Semitic and the Deputy will not apologise.

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You are bringing the House into appalling disrepute.

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Withdraw the comment.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

On a point of order-----

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There will be no point of order.

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It is on the record that he will not apologise.

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I will suspend the House if Members do not-----

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

No.

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Please, resume-----

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

It is a genuine point of order.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

A Member of this House previously had to apologise when making the kind of reference-----

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

-----that has been made to another Member of the House. I deem that what has been said in the House - the reference to Goebbels - is out of order and a smear-----

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A Cheann Comhairle, we have yet to make it to speaker No. 4.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

-----not only on the perpetrator-----

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The Deputy's point is made.

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

-----but on the House in general.

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Deputy Durkan's point is made.

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A Cheann Comhairle-----

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Bernard Durkan Deputy Bernard J. Durkan Fine Gael

Withdraw it.

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Just wait a second. The Deputy-----

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I was in the course of delivering a reply.

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The Minister had sat down.

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You were, and I will let the Minister do that in a minute, but I will respond to Deputy Durkan's point.

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I might opt not to-----

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The Minister sat down.

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-----given the state of disrepute into which a Member has brought the House.

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The weather is bringing the country to a standstill and Deputy MacSharry will bring the Dáil to a standstill.

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The Minister should please resume his seat. I have every intention of allowing him to respond to the points raised. Regarding the point of order, which referred to the Goebbels remark that has come from Deputy MacSharry, it was not directed, as I heard it, at any individual. If it had been, I would consider that to be deeply offensive.

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It was a collective remark, which was worse.

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It was a political charge-----

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Excuse me. It was a broad political charge-----

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It was directed at the Government.

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-----using the type of phraseology-----

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It was an anti-Semitic slur.

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-----that Deputy MacSharry uses from time to time.

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It was an anti-Semitic slur directed at every-----

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I do not consider-----

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It is not acceptable, a Cheann Comhairle.

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It was anti-Semitic.

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Please, I would-----

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It was an anti-Semitic comment.

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One cannot make anti-Semitic charges in the House.

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It was not anti-Semitic. It was a political charge.

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Resume your seat, please.

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It was anti-Semitic.

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We want to hear the Minister for Justice and Equality.

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It was an attack on the Jewish community in Ireland and the victims of the Holocaust, and it should be withdrawn.

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The Government is filibustering now and wasting time.

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Deputies, please. Allow the Minister for Justice and Equality.

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A Cheann Comhairle, I do not accept your ruling that the comment is not worthy of withdrawal.

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It was despicable.

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I ask the Ceann Comhairle as Chair and as the guardian of the rights and privileges of Members to ask Deputy MacSharry to withdraw his remark.

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An anti-Semitic remark.

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The Minister was answering the question.

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It is an anti-Semitic remark.

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I am not changing my ruling. My ruling has been made. If Deputy MacSharry wants to be helpful in the circumstances-----

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I am very disappointed.

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Well, maybe you might be.

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I am very disappointed.

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It is shocking, actually.

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I am very disappointed.

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It is offensive.

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We are being accused of being anti-Semitic.

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It is absolutely shocking.

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It is an anti-Semitic slur in the Dáil.

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If the Deputy wants to withdraw his remark he can.

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Will the Deputy sit down?

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On a point of order.

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A point of order.

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My understanding is that the ruling of the Chair is final-----

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Exactly.

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-----and it cannot be challenged by Members so perhaps the Minister would desist.

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Does Deputy Shortall believe it is acceptable?

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It does not make it right.

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An anti-Semitic slur.

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There is another place where the Minister can challenge that.

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Is Deputy Shortall supporting it?

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Does Deputy Shortall support that?

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Deputies, please.

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Will the two civil war parties please-----

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This is not about the civil war. It is about the Holocaust.

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Minister, please.

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The House stands suspended for five minutes.

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We will proceed with questions to the Taoiseach.

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A Cheann Comhairle, is-----

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The time is gone.

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For clarification, has the time for questions on promised legislation expired?

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Yes, the time has expired.

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