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Dáil
‹ Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Covid-19 reopening and travel controls

Summary

Deputy Shortall challenged the Government’s Covid strategy, arguing that delaying phases and easing travel rules were not enough to reduce case numbers. The Taoiseach said the plan was cautious reopening, school reopening, resuming non-Covid services, and strengthening airport and travel measures, while rejecting comparisons with New Zealand; the exchange ended over time.

On behalf of the Social Democrats, I wish to extend our deepest sympathy to the husband, daughter, family and friends of the late Ruth Morrissey on her tragic passing. She was a woman who was failed as a result of the negligence of the State. Regrettably, the apology to her has come too late.

What is the current strategy being pursued by the Government in respect of Covid-19? Until recently, the State followed public health advice, went into lockdown and largely succeeded in avoiding complete catastrophe. There have been many tragic deaths, but matters could have been so much worse. There is now widespread concern among the public that there is drift and that we risk undoing the hard work that has been done and sacrifices that have been made by so many over the past four months. In recent weeks, while we have been getting to grips with community transmission and opening up the country, it has become clear that the big weakness is the failure to control the importation of the virus from abroad. There is now major confusion about international travel. Promising to announce a green list of countries regarded as safe while at the same time advising against all non-essential travel is inherently contradictory. Of far greater concern is the Government's ambiguity regarding travel from countries that will not be on the green list. I refer to those countries that are regarded as unsafe due to a high prevalence of the virus. Not only has the Government operated a self-isolation policy which has been largely unenforceable in recent months, but, inexplicably, in the past couple of weeks the travel advice has changed.

It has been weakened for those countries. Incoming travellers are now advised merely to restrict their movements. This poses a great risk to our health, the lives of our vulnerable and to the economy. The priority now must be to create the circumstances which will allow us to reopen the schools in September and get our domestic economy fully operating. Controlling inward travel would allow us to do that. There are many good models of that kind of approach around the world, New Zealand being the most obvious example. That kind of approach has been called for by our Chief Medical Officer and by Professor Gabriel Scally, several other doctors and a great many in the scientific community. Phase 4 has been delayed because the numbers presenting with the virus have been rising. On what basis does the Taoiseach now expect the case numbers to reduce?

Comment on this

The strategy of the Government in the context of the roadmap that was outlined some weeks ago was to reopen society while at the same time suppressing the virus and keeping community transmission as low as possible. Societies and countries all over the world are experiencing difficulties in reopening, some a lot more severe than ours so far. The Government has taken a very cautious approach.

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What is the Taoiseach's strategy now?

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The Deputy has asked a question and is going to get the answer. I have made it clear, and I agree with what the Deputy has said, that the reopening of our schools at the end of August is the priority. The resumption of services for non-Covid illnesses and strands of health is a priority and it is challenging and very difficult. As the Deputy has said, aiding the recovery of our domestic economy as best we can is a priority and that is why the stimulus programme will be published, to outline a whole series of measures to make sure the economy can come back and recover in the context of a very severe pandemic. I am just back from the European Council meeting and have talked to other Ministers who have had far greater problems than we have had in terms of reopening and then having to lock down again. We are taking a very cautious approach and that is why we delayed phase 4. Understandably, we took some heat from people in rural Ireland when the pubs in particular were not opened but we did it because we felt it was the right thing to do in respect of public health.

We have never banned travel as a country since the beginning of this pandemic. However, if we look at the figures, travel has reduced dramatically compared to where we would have been last year. The Government will be meeting to decide on this issue. We actually postponed this idea of the green list of countries at the same or a lower level of the incidence of the virus than us. That was to come in some weeks ago but we postponed it in a cautious approach. We will take a cautious approach in that regard. We have made masks mandatory on public transport. We are now going to follow through on the advice from NPHET that we make masks mandatory in retail and other environments like that because it is important. This is an evolving virus.

The big question for all of us is how we live with Covid-19 for the foreseeable future. We have really tough issues, not just the Government but all of us as a society. We must try to maintain a level of economic activity that sustains employment, companies and jobs and gives them a fighting chance to emerge intact from Covid in 12 or 15 months' time. It is very challenging. That is why at 6 o'clock this morning we witnessed an unprecedented decision by Europe collectively to make €1.8 trillion available to try to recover and to provide the capacity to engineer a European economic recovery.

No one is certain that that will happen. The most effective way of keeping the economy going is to keep the transmission rate of the virus very low indeed and that is the objective of the Government.

Comment on this

With all due respect, delaying phase 4 is not a strategy. I asked the Taoiseach what the Government is actually doing now which will make the numbers go down. This seems completely ad hoc. We cannot revert to lockdown every time the numbers go up. Last Tuesday's official letter from NPHET to the Government was very clear about foreign travel. It said that there has been a 12% rate of travel-related cases, but more importantly, NPHET took note that there have been several clusters associated with that travel-related 12%. It went on in that letter to say that NPHET recommends that all measures are utilised to minimise and discourage non-essential travel from overseas to Ireland. The Taoiseach has not told us about any action that the Government is currently taking to discourage travel to Ireland. That is the key thing. We have to prevent the importation of this virus. Unless we do that, we are simply not going to be in a position to reopen our schools and to get the economy up and running again. I am asking the Taoiseach yet again what exactly the Government's strategy is in relation to, as the Taoiseach puts it, living with the virus. What steps is the Government taking to reduce the importation of the virus and to ensure that we can move forward to open the economy and get back to some kind of normality? Is the Government prepared to learn from New Zealand in terms of its success?

Comment on this

I do not think New Zealand is entirely comparable to Ireland. Let us be straight about that. It is not comparable in geography and many other issues. We should go behind the headlines sometimes. For example, people talk regularly about mandatory quarantine. It is not a great idea actually, and in some jurisdictions it actually led to a spread of the virus. This is not simple, and there are no easy answers. Travel into Ireland collapsed. There is very little travel into Ireland since the pandemic.

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But the Government is not doing anything about the red list.

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We have been discouraging travel since the beginning of the pandemic. The numbers are there to show it.

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The Government has actually eased the restrictions in the past two weeks.

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We did not ease the restrictions.

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No, the restricted movement is very severe. It essentially says someone can go to a shop. It is pretty clear, but it is very restricted

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It is very far from quarantine.

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Quarantine is a word that is bandied about the place with great ease and simplicity, but the Deputy knows and everybody here knows there are difficulties with enforcement around it. In response to the travel issue, the Government will strengthen our presence and strategies around the airports, the airlines, putting the passenger location form online and other measures.

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What is the Government doing-----

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Please, we cannot have a conversation about it.

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What is the Government doing that is going to make things change, to get the numbers to go down?

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Ireland has done very well with the virus.

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The numbers are going up. How is the Government going to get them to go down?

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The challenge is living with Covid for the foreseeable future, and we will be. The Deputy is correct in saying we cannot shut down for the next 12 months, but equally we must, in a balanced way, ensure we can get our schools reopened, get the non-Covid strand of medicine resumed, and make sure that we keep our domestic economy going.

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Thank you, Taoiseach. We are way over time.

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The Government is not doing anything differently-----

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Deputy Shortall, please.

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We already have made efforts.

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-----which will allow that to happen.

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Please, Deputy Shortall. I call Deputy Boyd Barrett.

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