The Government has spent years trying to convince religious orders to contribute to redress for the survivors of mother and baby homes. These efforts started in January 2021 when the then Minister, Roderic O'Gorman, first wrote to the orders saying they may wish to consider making a financial contribution to redress costs. His begging letters were ignored. In May 2023, the Government appointed former trade union official Sheila Nunan to negotiate with the orders. She was told to come back with a best and final offer from the orders within six months. Nearly two years later, Ms Nunan has filed her final report. It states that just one order has made a serious offer of cash to pay redress.

Going cap in hand to religious orders was not a successful strategy. This is hardly surprising in view of the fact that we know these orders would much prefer to pay their armies of lawyers than the women and children they tortured and abused. These orders own assets worth hundreds of millions. For decades in Ireland, unimaginable horrors were perpetrated in mother and baby homes. The infant mortality rate in these institutions was five times the national average. There were thousands of unexplained infants deaths, missing children and multiple mass unmarked graves. Women and children were subjected to incarceration, forced labour, vaccine trials and horrific physical and sexual abuse. Families were ripped apart, there were forced adoptions and children were boarded out to act as indentured servants. There has never been any accountability for any of these crimes. Religious orders that made millions on the back of enslaving women and children are walking away without paying a penny because the Government is allowing them to run rings around it. We have report after report documenting the crimes of these orders, not just in mother and baby homes but also in religious-run schools. When will the State finally flex some legal muscle when it comes to these religious orders? Why are these orders not raided by the Garda? Why are their assets not seized? It is unbelievable that the approach of successive Governments to these orders, which operated as criminal networks, is to roll over. What will it take for the State to finally act and go after these orders with more than a begging bowl?

On Monday afternoon, the Minister received from Ms Nunan, the negotiator who was appointed, her report on negotiations with religious organisations associated with the mother and baby institutions payment scheme. The Minister will have to review that report and come back to Government in relation to it.

The Government has not gone cap in hand to anyone. The Government took its own decisions in respect of a redress scheme for those in mother and baby homes. It is quite a substantial scheme, which will total up to €800 million or more. I accept not everyone felt that was enough, but it was a first substantive response by the State in respect of mother and baby homes. There have been other responses in respect of industrial schools and Magdalen laundries which have been extensive. Each of these involved different dimensions.

On mother and baby institutions, we will assess the report and see where we go next. We cannot simply go in and raid premises. I am sure the Deputy appreciates there have to be processes regarding the legality of whatever the Government does. Suffice to say that the Government did not wait around for religious orders.

In the context of the industrial schools, I recall that the Government at that time was attacked for having a redress scheme and not having a substantive contribution from the religious orders in advance of doing that. The Deputy is correct to say religious orders will utilise lawyers and legal mechanisms to frustrate what the Government is attempting to do. The Government of the day, like the current Administration, focused on the survivors and victims of these institutions. If we had been waiting around for a legal process to try to garner from orders the necessary resources in order to have a redress scheme, we would never have had one. That is the position, unfortunately. Either way, the Government will be criticised and condemned. On balance, however, in trying to respond to survivors and victims, it is better that the State develops independently its redress schemes and endeavours to seeks returns from the religious orders. We will see what we can do and what options are open to us. I have not read or seen the report. I just read a report about it in the media this morning. There are options we can follow in getting contributions from the religious orders.

I have not been asking for the Government to wait around in the context of a redress scheme; I am asking what it is going to do when it comes to going after these religious orders. This has been going on for years. We are talking about religious orders with assets worth hundreds of millions of euro, partly financed off the back of incarceration, forced labour, vaccine trials and forced adoptions. They have the resources to pay. Why is the State not vigorously pursuing these orders? Compare this with how the State treats its own citizens. When ordinary people attempt to vindicate their rights in the courts, the State fights them every step of the way. Why is the State failing to flex its legal muscle when pursuing these orders? What is the Government going to do to make these orders pay?

As I stated, our view is that the orders have a collective and moral responsibility to respond to Ireland's legacy in relation to the mother and baby institutions. As I also stated, we just received the report on Monday.

We will assess that report and then consider what options we can take - within the law, obviously - in terms of persuading religious orders in respect of the mother and baby institutions. As I said earlier, it is a matter on which we will have to take advice in terms of the precise and specific issues that pertain to mother and baby homes, which will be different to those that applied to the industrial schools, for example, where the State was directly involved in terms of inspectorial reports and inspections of those schools. It was the State that put many young people into industrial schools, unlike mother and baby homes. The State was not directly involved in the latter. Nonetheless, we will see what is the most effective way to get a contribution from the religious orders and what options are available.